My Cavalier Issues.. Part II

[ASIAN JUL]

Okay, so as some of you may know the story from before, some of you may not, here's a bit of a back story..

Back in early December, my car, virtually out of nowhere started idling pretty rough. The tach was jumping around between 500 and 1,000 rpms and the car was shaking pretty bad. Check engine light was on, etc. Took it to a place - they had it for a few days. They at first replaced the spark plugs. Problem not fixed. Then they replaced a fuel injector, insisting that it was definitely the problem - installed it, didn't help the problem - they took it back out. Then after a few days they decided it was the timing chain (yes, chain, I don't feel like having everyone go "you mean belt?" No. It's a chain) and that it must've skipped a tooth. Their bottom line was that it and the tensioner would need to be replaced, told me not to drive it for much longer without fixing it. Their estimate for that was $1200. Well, I had shelled out the $450 or so for the brake pads, rotors, oil, spark plugs, and labor and at the time, no other money to dish out. So I said, screw it, I'll drive it around until I can fix it. Then I lost my job.

So, I've been driving it around since December.. same problems, tach jumps, it idles rough. But nowwww, the car hasn't wanted to start about 4 times int the last 3 days, I've had to give it gas. Car almost stalled this past weekend when B turned the a/c on (I assume this is unrelated, though). When I drive, the "Trac Off" light randomly comes on, then randomly goes back off. When I go from a stop, my car lurches/jerks and it's pretty bad - feels like I'm about to stall (actually it feels like how it felt to try to go into first when I first learned stick hahaha), then with a little lead foot persuasion, it goes forward a little, then jerks really bad through second. Seems to be okay after that. Oh, and, it may be my imagination but I also feel like my car is going through gas too fast.

Cliff notes:
Car idles real rough
Shop tried new plugs, fuel injector - it didn't help
Diagnosed as timing chain skipped a tooth
Car jerks really bad going from a stop

So, I'm wondering.. what could this be? Even if you think it's far fetched, throw it out there! Because I'm clueless. I know I know nothing about cars at all - so I'd like to understand or get an idea of what could be wrong, hence my asking. Perhaps this is a dumb suggestion, but could something be wrong with my transmission?

Any, all suggestions would be great.


By the way, 03 Cavalier & it's auto trans.

[GeforceXtreme]

Originally Posted by MyCarIsFTL

Okay, so as some of you may know the story from before, some of you may not, here's a bit of a back story..

Back in early December, my car, virtually out of nowhere started idling pretty rough. The tach was jumping around between 500 and 1,000 rpms and the car was shaking pretty bad. Check engine light was on, etc. Took it to a place - they had it for a few days. They at first replaced the spark plugs. Problem not fixed. Then they replaced a fuel injector, insisting that it was definitely the problem - installed it, didn't help the problem - they took it back out. Then after a few days they decided it was the timing chain (yes, chain, I don't feel like having everyone go "you mean belt?" No. It's a chain) and that it must've skipped a tooth. Their bottom line was that it and the tensioner would need to be replaced, told me not to drive it for much longer without fixing it. Their estimate for that was $1200. Well, I had shelled out the $450 or so for the brake pads, rotors, oil, spark plugs, and labor and at the time, no other money to dish out. So I said, screw it, I'll drive it around until I can fix it. Then I lost my job.

So, I've been driving it around since December.. same problems, tach jumps, it idles rough. But nowwww, the car hasn't wanted to start about 4 times int the last 3 days, I've had to give it gas. Car almost stalled this past weekend when B turned the a/c on (I assume this is unrelated, though). When I drive, the "Trac Off" light randomly comes on, then randomly goes back off. When I go from a stop, my car lurches/jerks and it's pretty bad - feels like I'm about to stall (actually it feels like how it felt to try to go into first when I first learned stick hahaha), then with a little lead foot persuasion, it goes forward a little, then jerks really bad through second. Seems to be okay after that. Oh, and, it may be my imagination but I also feel like my car is going through gas too fast.

Cliff notes:
Car idles real rough
Shop tried new plugs, fuel injector - it didn't help
Diagnosed as timing chain skipped a tooth
Car jerks really bad going from a stop

So, I'm wondering.. what could this be? Even if you think it's far fetched, throw it out there! Because I'm clueless. I know I know nothing about cars at all - so I'd like to understand or get an idea of what could be wrong, hence my asking. Perhaps this is a dumb suggestion, but could something be wrong with my transmission?

Any, all suggestions would be great.


By the way, 03 Cavalier & it's auto trans.

How many miles are on your car? I picked up an 04 Cavalier back in January with around 92K on it. It still has the original timing chain and I am not experiencing any problems like yours. There are a few people I have talked too that had gone 150K+ on the original timing chain without any problems. I would have to guess your car has less then what mine has so I really can't see the timing chain being an issue already. It sounds like it could be a sensor going bad that hasn't been replaced yet. Do you get any check engine lights while you are driving the car?

I just did a full tune up on my car and before it drove fine however after replacing those parts I noticed a big difference this is was it consisted of:

oil/filter
fuel filter
spark plugs
air filter
02 sensor

I am not saying replacing all those is going to fix the problem however those are the key "tune up" parts you usually replace to make a car run efficient. Who knows if one of those items is really badly defective and is making your car run like crap.

Another thing it could be is a device called the Igntion Modular. Its that silver fin looking box that's to the right of where it says 2.2 Ecotec on the top of your motor. That controls the spark plugs and I have heard of those going on other cars but not normally the Ecotec.

There is also another sensor called a Crank Position sensor that tells the computer when to fire the spark plugs. If that is damaged that could be throwing off the spark of the car. However like I said before you car most likely does not have anymore then 60K and I just can't see all of this being a problem already.

Its a sin you are having such a problem with your car. The 2003+ have the new 2.2 Ecotec motor and its normally one of the best motors to come in these cars. I will post your problem on Cavalier site and see if anyone has an answer for this for you.

[ASIAN JUL]

Originally Posted by GeforceXtreme

How many miles are on your car? I picked up an 04 Cavalier back in January with around 92K on it. It still has the original timing chain and I am not experiencing any problems like yours. There are a few people I have talked too that had gone 150K+ on the original timing chain without any problems. I would have to guess your car has less then what mine has so I really can't see the timing chain being an issue already. It sounds like it could be a sensor going bad that hasn't been replaced yet. Do you get any check engine lights while you are driving the car?

85K.

I just did a full tune up on my car and before it drove fine however after replacing those parts I noticed a big difference this is was it consisted of:

oil/filter
fuel filter
spark plugs
air filter
02 sensor

I am not saying replacing all those is going to fix the problem however those are the key "tune up" parts you usually replace to make a car run efficient. Who knows if one of those items is really badly defective and is making your car run like crap.

They did the oil and spark plugs. Not sure about the fuel filter, air filter or O2 sensor.

Another thing it could be is a device called the Igntion Modular. Its that silver fin looking box that's to the right of where it says 2.2 Ecotec on the top of your motor. That controls the spark plugs and I have heard of those going on other cars but not normally the Ecotec.

Hm, I'm going to have to look that up, since I don't know what "going" means, lol.

There is also another sensor called a Crank Position sensor that tells the computer when to fire the spark plugs. If that is damaged that could be throwing off the spark of the car. However like I said before you car most likely does not have anymore then 60K and I just can't see all of this being a problem already.

Its a sin you are having such a problem with your car. The 2003+ have the new 2.2 Ecotec motor and its normally one of the best motors to come in these cars. I will post your problem on Cavalier site and see if anyone has an answer for this for you.

The last two things you brought up weren't suggested by the shop, so maybe they didn't check or maybe they did and didn't tell me. Again, I'll have to look up the crank position sensor and the ignition modular since I don't know what they are - haha.

Thank you sooo much for the response. I really appreciate it.

[MANLYmiata]

same thing used to happen to my old car..
turned out to be the thermostat and the radiator eventually just blew up outside of my house.

[GeforceXtreme]

When I said "going" I meant they fail/break.

On my first car (not the Cavalier) the car was running perfectly fine. After shutting the car off and went to start it again it would not start. It would crank and crank but not fire over. I replaced just about everything and found out the crank sensor (which was bad) was not telling the ignition modular (that tells the spark plugs to fire) was the cause of the problem. Once I replaced my crank sensor the car fired right up like nothing ever happened. Usally when the crank sensor goes bad the car will not start what so ever. However it maybe "somewhat" working and maybe is the reason why the car runs like crap then sometimes you have a very hard time starting it? That sensor is very cheap however I have never installed one on a Cavalier so no idea if its easy or not.

Later on down the road my old car was running like role crap like yours is. Once again replaced everything and the last thing I replaced was the ignition modular and everything went back to running smoothly. The only problem is buying an ingiton modular new is like $200-$300+.

Like I said before these are just "possible" parts that could be causing your problem. I hate for you to replace them and still not have it running right. Being you only have 85K I JUST can't see those being a problem.

It could even be as simple as the 02 (oxygen) sensor. That sensor monitors the exhaust and if it detects the car running too rich (gassy) or lean (not gassy enough) it tells the computer to change its settings. That 02 sensor could be broken and the computer has no idea what is going on and it dumping fuel into your motor causing it to waste gas and run like crap.

If you are getting any check engine lights still on your dash take it to Autozone or Advanced auto and they will scan the car for error codes for free. Write those down and that may help you to solve the problem easier.

I posted on that other site I will let you know what they say.

[ASIAN JUL]

Originally Posted by GeforceXtreme

When I said "going" I meant they fail/break.

On my first car (not the Cavalier) the car was running perfectly fine. After shutting the car off and went to start it again it would not start. It would crank and crank but not fire over. I replaced just about everything and found out the crank sensor (which was bad) was not telling the ignition modular (that tells the spark plugs to fire) was the cause of the problem. Once I replaced my crank sensor the car fired right up like nothing ever happened. Usally when the crank sensor goes bad the car will not start what so ever. However it maybe "somewhat" working and maybe is the reason why the car runs like crap then sometimes you have a very hard time starting it? That sensor is very cheap however I have never installed one on a Cavalier so no idea if its easy or not.

Again, not to be blatantly cartarded, but is there a way to tell by simply looking at either of these two things? Or would I need to replace them and then see if it changes?

It could even be as simple as the 02 (oxygen) sensor. That sensor monitors the exhaust and if it detects the car running too rich (gassy) or lean (not gassy enough) it tells the computer to change its settings. That 02 sensor could be broken and the computer has no idea what is going on and it dumping fuel into your motor causing it to waste gas and run like crap.

Yeah, I'm assuming the O2 sensor would be solely the cause of the gas getting eaten like crazy? Or could that also be causing the near-stalling issues and rough idling issues as well?

If you are getting any check engine lights still on your dash take it to Autozone or Advanced auto and they will scan the car for error codes for free. Write those down and that may help you to solve the problem easier.

I forgot to mention - the shop had these two OBDII codes when they scanned - P0300 and 1441 - I haven't checked since, though.

I posted on that other site I will let you know what they say.

Thank you for posting on the other site.

One more question, sorry I'm asking like a million! Is there any chance you think this could be the transmission going?

[Elliott18t]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_does_...chevy_cavalier

other is missfire.. idk if you got those already though lol

[TrboChicsRock]

Originally Posted by MyCarIsFTL

P0300

This is a random misfire code, which is probably why they replaced the spark plugs. Since that didn't fix it, my guess is it's coil related.

[ASIAN JUL]

Also - this is the list of what they did before:


What they did:
Changed brake pads/rotors
Changed oil
Changed sparkplugs
Checked for VAC leaks
Checked motor mounts
Checked the CEL - came up with P0300 and 1441
Ran a compression test
Thought it was a fuel injector problem
Cleaned the fuel injector
Decided it wasn't enough, ordered a new one
Installed it, didn't fix the problem
Took the valve cover off
Etc., etc..........which led them to their conclusion of timing chain skipping a tooth or something

[Vr-4-Life]

Wow you shouldnt pay mechanics anything to just do guess work... its obvious they wernt sure of the problem.

check your dizzy or coil packs.

[GeforceXtreme]

Guys over on the Cavalier site it sounds like it could be a bad TPS (Throttle Position Sensor). If that is not reading correctly how much gas you are giving the car it can throw everything off from fueling, spark, and transmission shifts.

[zuki19]

TPS, Cranks sensor also..

[zuki19]

even a failing MAF will do it.

[ASIAN JUL]

Mass airflow sensor?

[Elliott18t]

yes. [

[Xavier]

TPS sensor is working fine. From running it last night while a scan tool was hooked up I could see the TPS reading correctly. What is going on at idle is multiple misfires, mostly on cylinder 3, sometimes cylinder 4. Cylinder 3 had 20,000 something misfires stored, so now possibly thinking coils or valves.

[Vr-4-Life]

Coils

[Xavier]

I've had some buddies who are more knowledgeable on the Ecos also say that the Ignition Modules do go bad sometimes, so it may be worth checking that out as well.

[ASIAN JUL]

Okay, well, you can check, and then I can watch you check, and then you can go reaaaal slow and tell me what you're doing lol.

[russiankid]

I remember reading that the Module on GM's is mounted to a metal plate which provides grounding to the module. That plate becomes dirty overtime so it does not provide a good ground. Cleaning it solves the problem. However I am not sure if a Cavi has the same setup as the 3.1's, 3.8's, etc...