Will the plane take off? - TriStateTuners.com :: Home of Tristate Auto Enthusiast

pearl · 12-18-2007, 04:34 PM

This is a big topic on Honda-tech, just wondering what you guys think about it.

Quote:

If a plane is traveling at takeoff speed on a conveyor belt, and that conveyor belt is matching the speed in reverse, can the plane take off?

Cardriverx · 12-18-2007, 04:37 PM

yes, the plane is powered by jet engines pushing on the plane body, not spinning the wheels. The wheels would just be spinning double the rate of normal.

whitezenki · 12-18-2007, 04:38 PM

Blah, i voted no.

I'm wrong.

I have a plane, but never tried flyin it off a conveyor belt.

Quick thinking owns me.

DropTopChevy · 12-18-2007, 04:40 PM

This is already a thread like 2 years ago

teh DIRT · 12-18-2007, 04:40 PM

omg omg omg omg omg.

but since it is SOOO old, and some members probably weren't around for its torture...ENJOY!

jspek · 12-18-2007, 04:41 PM

^agreed.

Renegade_ · 12-18-2007, 04:43 PM

This goddamn "riddle" doesn't go away does it? If someone doesn't get the right answer to this they are pretty dumb.

DropTopChevy · 12-18-2007, 04:44 PM

http://www.tristatetuners.com/forum/...ad.php?t=7435&
Found it.

ITSTOCK · 12-18-2007, 04:48 PM

Theoretically, yes, it could take off. It depends on the exact controlled variables.

Renegade_ · 12-18-2007, 04:50 PM

When someone talks about speed it is always relative to the ground (earth), not the conveyor belt. There's a hint. High school physics teaches you this. The speed you might see on a hypothetical "speedometer" inside the airplane measures the speed of the wheels, not the plane itself.

DropTopChevy · 12-18-2007, 04:56 PM

No, with the conveyor keeping it in spot the plane will not recieve the amount of lift it would need at the speed in which it is capable of taking off at normally, if that makes sense.

Harrier Jet FTW.

97TurboDSM · 12-18-2007, 04:58 PM

holy super old topic

Renegade_ · 12-18-2007, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DropTopChevy

No, with the conveyor keeping it in spot the plane will not recieve the amount of lift it would need at the speed in which it is capable of taking off at normally, if that makes sense.

Harrier Jet FTW.

Thrust isn't the same as a car being propelled by traction. A car on a dyno stays still but a jet on a dyno wouldn't matter how fast the rollers move because the jet doesn't rely on the wheels to move it. The thrust would just move it forward. (I'm putting it in car terms

)

The friction of the bearings in the wheels won't be enough to hold a jet back with the thousands of pounds of thrust it puts out. Then again if the jet were to reach takeoff speed the bearings in the wheels would just explode because of all the thousands of watts of energy it needs to displace.

So basically it won't take off because the wheels would just explode before any other variable could happen if the conveyor belt was keeping it still, but if it could move across the conveyor belt (like it should) then it "could" take off.

pearl · 12-18-2007, 05:01 PM

fair enough, lock it, its a repost. it is a great off topic discussion though.

james_ls · 12-18-2007, 05:20 PM

No.

Just cause.

NJGOAT · 12-18-2007, 05:26 PM

Yes it will take off as long as the wheels can spin as fast as they need to. Let's assume the jet powers up and starts moving forward at 1mph. The belt will then start moving 1mph in the opposite direction. Since the engines are pushing on the body of the plane and the wheels are simply there to hold up the plane and rotate freely, the wheels would be spinning forward at 2mph.

The problem with the whole riddle is that it isn't specific enough. If the conveyor matches the speed of the plane, then yes it will take off. However, if it is matching the speed of the wheels then the plane would never move and the wheels and conveyor would spin to infinite.

wrx_snobordr · 12-18-2007, 05:58 PM

Yes.

The wheels are only a way to decrease friction with the ground, not a means of producing propulsion. The wheels of the jet would simply be spinning at twice the air speed of the jet at take off. Think of it in reverse. If an F-18 was coming into land on an aircraft carrier and there was a conveyor belt spinning at the exact speed, but opposite direction of travel, to the jet would it stop dead if hitting a brick wall? NO, it would simply continue forward at a slightly slower speed, due to some resistance in a bearings, and if not caught by the cable it would go into the ocean.

ITSTOCK · 12-18-2007, 06:08 PM

^ thanks to the lift generated by its wings during its slow descent, of course......

redline · 12-18-2007, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITSTOCK

^ thanks to the lift generated by its wings during its slow descent, of course......

Yes it needs air flow across and under the wings to create low pressure and lift to fly, so NO the plane would not take off!

pearl · 12-18-2007, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redline

Yes it needs air flow across and under the wings to create low pressure and lift to fly, so NO the plane would not take off!

looks like this may be a good thread after all

View Poll Results: Will the plane take off?
Yes	38	53.52%
No	33	46.48%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

12-18-2007, 04:37 PM	#2
Cardriverx Tri-State Addict Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: media Member #5090 My Ride: 1993 Miata Turbo ; 2001 Saab 9-5 Aero Wagon iTrader: (1)	yes, the plane is powered by jet engines pushing on the plane body, not spinning the wheels. The wheels would just be spinning double the rate of normal. __________________ 93 Turbo Miata, T3/T4 14 psi, megasquirt II ECU, once I get the tune dialed in, about 230 HP. =) 01 Saab 9-5 Aero wagon, my DD. Great Fun. Stock.. for now. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

12-18-2007, 04:38 PM	#3
whitezenki Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: South Jersey Member #3121 My Ride: 1992 Nissan 240sx iTrader: (0)	Blah, i voted no. I'm wrong. I have a plane, but never tried flyin it off a conveyor belt. Quick thinking owns me. __________________ The Pirates of Death and Destruction set out to annihilate and humiliate through Brutal Carnage. You gonna drive it, or buy it a dress? To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures. Last edited by whitezenki; 12-18-2007 at 04:42 PM.

12-18-2007, 04:40 PM	#4
DropTopChevy Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: In a big house Member #242 My Ride: 2002 2.8 30V V6 iTrader: (6)	This is already a thread like 2 years ago __________________ The great thing about being an architect is that you can walk into your dreams. - Harold E. Wagoner, 1986

12-18-2007, 04:43 PM	#7
Renegade_ Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: May 2006 Location: NNJ/NYC Member #1912 My Ride: 1J Swaggon iTrader: (2)	This goddamn "riddle" doesn't go away does it? If someone doesn't get the right answer to this they are pretty dumb. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

12-18-2007, 04:44 PM	#8
DropTopChevy Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: In a big house Member #242 My Ride: 2002 2.8 30V V6 iTrader: (6)	http://www.tristatetuners.com/forum/...ad.php?t=7435& Found it. __________________ The great thing about being an architect is that you can walk into your dreams. - Harold E. Wagoner, 1986

12-18-2007, 04:48 PM	#9
ITSTOCK Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Sep 2005 Member #844 iTrader: (0)	Theoretically, yes, it could take off. It depends on the exact controlled variables. Last edited by ITSTOCK; 12-19-2007 at 12:39 AM.

12-18-2007, 04:50 PM	#10
Renegade_ Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: May 2006 Location: NNJ/NYC Member #1912 My Ride: 1J Swaggon iTrader: (2)	When someone talks about speed it is always relative to the ground (earth), not the conveyor belt. There's a hint. High school physics teaches you this. The speed you might see on a hypothetical "speedometer" inside the airplane measures the speed of the wheels, not the plane itself. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

12-18-2007, 04:56 PM	#11
DropTopChevy Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: In a big house Member #242 My Ride: 2002 2.8 30V V6 iTrader: (6)	No, with the conveyor keeping it in spot the plane will not recieve the amount of lift it would need at the speed in which it is capable of taking off at normally, if that makes sense. Harrier Jet FTW. __________________ The great thing about being an architect is that you can walk into your dreams. - Harold E. Wagoner, 1986

12-18-2007, 04:58 PM	#12
97TurboDSM TST Ruined My Life! Join Date: Sep 2005 Member #849 My Ride: '03 IY 20th GTI iTrader: (3)	holy super old topic __________________ FOR SALE! Canon 5D\|17-40L\|85mm f/1.8\|Sigmalux\|580ex

12-18-2007, 05:01 PM	#14
pearl Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: NEW JERSEY Member #1108 My Ride: suck it trebek iTrader: (0)	fair enough, lock it, its a repost. it is a great off topic discussion though. __________________ Last Activity: 03-24-2009 12:05 PM

12-18-2007, 05:20 PM	#15
james_ls TST Ruined My Life! Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Warrington Member #1614 My Ride: 1998 Acura Integra LS//VTEC iTrader: (0)	No. Just cause. __________________ *Heller Dope* - When the ** is doper than Hellen Keller; it's Heller Dope To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures. BUY MY STUFF!** To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

12-18-2007, 05:26 PM	#16
NJGOAT Tri-State Addict Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Moorestown, NJ Member #1583 iTrader: (0)	Yes it will take off as long as the wheels can spin as fast as they need to. Let's assume the jet powers up and starts moving forward at 1mph. The belt will then start moving 1mph in the opposite direction. Since the engines are pushing on the body of the plane and the wheels are simply there to hold up the plane and rotate freely, the wheels would be spinning forward at 2mph. The problem with the whole riddle is that it isn't specific enough. If the conveyor matches the speed of the plane, then yes it will take off. However, if it is matching the speed of the wheels then the plane would never move and the wheels and conveyor would spin to infinite. __________________ *Current Ride:* 2004 Audi A6 2.7T S-Line *Former Rides:* 2005 VW Jetta GLI, 2003 Chevy Avalanche, 2000 Audi A4, 2004 Pontiac GTO, 2003 VW Jetta GLI, 1998 Mustang GT, 1994 Jeep Wrangler To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 signatures.

12-18-2007, 05:58 PM	#17
wrx_snobordr Tri-State Addict Join Date: Dec 2004 Member #21 iTrader: (1)	Yes. The wheels are only a way to decrease friction with the ground, not a means of producing propulsion. The wheels of the jet would simply be spinning at twice the air speed of the jet at take off. Think of it in reverse. If an F-18 was coming into land on an aircraft carrier and there was a conveyor belt spinning at the exact speed, but opposite direction of travel, to the jet would it stop dead if hitting a brick wall? NO, it would simply continue forward at a slightly slower speed, due to some resistance in a bearings, and if not caught by the cable it would go into the ocean. __________________ Stock

12-18-2007, 06:08 PM	#18
ITSTOCK Tri-State Post Whore Join Date: Sep 2005 Member #844 iTrader: (0)	^ thanks to the lift generated by its wings during its slow descent, of course......

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