The official TST I like guns thread.

[awdlaserbeam]

One of the first questions beginners usually ask is, "How often should i clean my gun? Do i need to clean it after every time i shoot it?" The answer to that question is, "it depends."

If you are cleaning a range toy rather than a defensive gun, you can probably allow the crud to build up a little bit before cleaning it, even though it is usually somewhat easier to remove the crud when the cleaning is done immediately. Years ago, back when buffalo roamed the plains, everyone shot black-powder rifles which absolutely positively had to be cleaned immediately after shooting, because black power was (and is) such a corrosive substance that it would ruin the gun if the fouling were left in the barrel. Modern powder is not corrosive, and so it won't eat its way through the metal of your barrel if it gets in there for awhile.

The fouling can and often does affect reliability, however. Uncleaned guns are more apt to jam when you most need them. Because the crud can slow down the slide, dirty semi-automatic firearms are prone to failures to feed or failures to completely eject the spent cases. Uncleaned revolvers are prone to binding up, and the double-action trigger can become difficult or impossiible to pull if the cylinder isn't turning easily. Poorly-cleaned or uncleaned firearms are thus far less reliable than their well-cleaned and properly lubricated counterparts.

For this reason, i highly recommend that you clean your defensive handgun immediatley after every trip to the range, no matter how many or how few shots you fire. Since you will be betting your life on the function of your gun, it's a good idea to keep it as clean as you can, in order to avoid fouling-related problems.

[ITSTOCK]

Originally Posted by awdlaserbeam

One of the first questions beginners usually ask is, "How often should i clean my gun? Do i need to clean it after every time i shoot it?" The answer to that question is, "it depends."

If you are cleaning a range toy rather than a defensive gun, you can probably allow the crud to build up a little bit before cleaning it, even though it is usually somewhat easier to remove the crud when the cleaning is done immediately. Years ago, back when buffalo roamed the plains, everyone shot black-powder rifles which absolutely positively had to be cleaned immediately after shooting, because black power was (and is) such a corrosive substance that it would ruin the gun if the fouling were left in the barrel. Modern powder is not corrosive, and so it won't eat its way through the metal of your barrel if it gets in there for awhile.

The fouling can and often does affect reliability, however. Uncleaned guns are more apt to jam when you most need them. Because the crud can slow down the slide, dirty semi-automatic firearms are prone to failures to feed or failures to completely eject the spent cases. Uncleaned revolvers are prone to binding up, and the double-action trigger can become difficult or impossiible to pull if the cylinder isn't turning easily. Poorly-cleaned or uncleaned firearms are thus far less reliable than their well-cleaned and properly lubricated counterparts.

For this reason, i highly recommend that you clean your defensive handgun immediatley after every trip to the range, no matter how many or how few shots you fire. Since you will be betting your life on the function of your gun, it's a good idea to keep it as clean as you can, in order to avoid fouling-related problems.

Overall I agree, but a decent self defense gun will not become dirty enough to affect reliability after shooting only a couple of rounds! I would NEVER own a self defense gun that I have to worry about not being reliable while having some dirt in it! Another "theory" that a lot of people have is that after they take their self defense gun to fire a few rounds, they do NOT want to strip the gun down! If they know that the gun works perfect at the range, there is no need to strip the gun and have the stars not align properly (speaking of paranoid). On the flip side, I know that a lot of LEO's have to clean their guns religiously simply because if something does happen such as an AD (which is extremely rare, as it's 99% of the time ND), and the gun is dirty, they will be responsible.

[ITSTOCK]

Thanks to Gorrilla Unit 33, this is what is going on the lower!

From this thread...
http://www.tristatetuners.com/forum/...768#post794768

[bjc26]

Okay I need some barrel advice for my AR. I am currently building a mid-length AR and have everything I need purchased except the barrel and optics. I have narrowed it down to two choices and would like to hear everyones take on which is better, and any reasoning behind it.

1. 14.5" barrel, mid-length gas system, Permanently affixed brake (NJ) bringing oal to the required 16". Flip up front sight on gas block.
2. 16.0" barrel, mid-length gas system, Permanently affixed brake (NJ) bringing oal over the required 16". Flip up front sight on gas block.

Also lightweight, or standard barrel?

So they are basically the same setup other than the overall length. Basically 2" in length difference give or take. I'm thinking some ballistic differences and obviously weight and maneuverability. Anything else?

Thanks in advance.

[BradC]

Originally Posted by bjc26

Okay I need some barrel advice for my AR. I am currently building a mid-length AR and have everything I need purchased except the barrel and optics. I have narrowed it down to two choices and would like to hear everyones take on which is better, and any reasoning behind it.

1. 14.5" barrel, mid-length gas system, Permanently affixed brake (NJ) bringing oal to the required 16". Flip up front sight on gas block.
2. 16.0" barrel, mid-length gas system, Permanently affixed brake (NJ) bringing oal over the required 16". Flip up front sight on gas block.

Also lightweight, or standard barrel?

So they are basically the same setup other than the overall length. Basically 2" in length difference give or take. I'm thinking some ballistic differences and obviously weight and maneuverability. Anything else?

Thanks in advance.

What is the purpose of your AR?

Plinker, Home Defense, SHTF?

What will the exact OAL be with each barrel and flash hider?

[bjc26]

Originally Posted by BradC

What is the purpose of your AR?

Plinker, Home Defense, SHTF?

What will the exact OAL be with each barrel and flash hider?

It will see some good range time 100-300yd max. It might have a home defense use in a shtf scenario, in which case you could justify the shorter length. I plan on building a 18 or 20" model in the next 6 months for longer range with a bit more accuracy. I have other firearms that can reach out a little further than the AR should the situation require it.

As far as OAL. 14.5" barrel with brake will be just about 16" even. Therefore I'm going to say the 16" with the same exact brake would be 17.5". The peoples republic of NJ does not allow flash hiders, only brakes and all permanently attached.

[BradC]

Originally Posted by bjc26

It will see some good range time 100-300yd max. It might have a home defense use in a shtf scenario, in which case you could justify the shorter length. I plan on building a 18 or 20" model in the next 6 months for longer range with a bit more accuracy. I have other firearms that can reach out a little further than the AR should the situation require it.

As far as OAL. 14.5" barrel with brake will be just about 16" even. Therefore I'm going to say the 16" with the same exact brake would be 17.5". The peoples republic of NJ does not allow flash hiders, only brakes and all permanently attached.

If you plan on also building a longer one, and have something to reach out and touch someone already, go as short as the People's Republic of NJ will let you.

Personally, I want to build a full-length A4 variant.

[bjc26]

Shortest allowable is 16". I wasn't sure everyones take on the extra barrel length.

[awdlaserbeam]

long barrel... i say try and make get the best performance gain out of it and have some fun with that. Its also something i would think that would be a little less common to see. Even though you may have other guns that could get you out a little farther, the AR would still have a total different feel.

there are plenty of other options out there for home defense. I say try and get the best out of that gun you can, i think it would be more suited toward your application and time spent using it.... Is that extra 1.5" really gonna cause you to bang into walls and prevent you from defending yourself??? If so, your gonna need to rely on other tactics rather than a shorter barrel....

[ITSTOCK]

The actual performance between the 14.5" and 16" barrels are pretty much nill. The bullet gains roughly 100fps more velocity out of the 16" barrel, and accuracy doesn't change much at all...if any at 100-300 yards.

The 14.5" barrel will feel more balanced, and since you aren't in to competitive shooting...or at least no matter which barrel length you go with, it's not going to make a difference. A HUGE reason people select the 16" barrel over the 14.5" is because it gives them the option of different flash hiders/brakes. HOWEVER, in your commie state, it doesn't make a difference. In my opinion, and in others (and vice versa), there is a noticeable difference in 1.5" of overall length. At 50-100 yards, my 10.5" barreled (pistol) is just as accurate as the 16", and even my 20" barreled ar's. Past 300 yards, the 14.5" or the 16" aren't exactly the greatest options. The 16" with irons might be more accurate because of a longer site radius. If both have optics, it doesn't make a difference.

Now you have to decide on heavy barrel or standard/pencil. The big advantage to the heavy barrel isn't just accuracy, since there really isn't much of a difference in terms of accuracy between the heavy and pencil (I have a both, again, accuracy is nill). The advantage is that the heavy barrel retains the accuracy from the given position. The huge, and obvious trade off is weight. But with the 14.5" barrel, the gun is going to be more balanced compared to a longer barrel, which makes the weight trade off very negligible, were talking a couple of ounces. This one is really up to you, do you want it lighter? Or in theory, a barrel that is going to last longer (the pencil and the heavy are both going to far exceed any use that you can put it through).

Next you need to decide on chrome lined vs not lined. Since we already established that you aren't going to be a competitive, professional long distance shooter, go with chrome lined. It's less accurate (to the pros) but is more durable and easier to clean.

The last decision is what twist do you want? For the ammo. that you are going to be shooting (probably either 55 or 62 grain), you want the 1:9. It's the best overall compromise for your given circumstance.


14.5" Heavy OR Pencil barrel, chrome lined 1:9 twist.

[ITSTOCK]

Originally Posted by BradC

If you plan on also building a longer one, and have something to reach out and touch someone already, go as short as the People's Republic of NJ will let you.

Personally, I want to build a full-length A4 variant.

My 20" ar's are the only guns that I don't shoot. If you want a varmit killer or longer range, you need the 20-24" bull barrel.

[garrettej8]

here's a quick shot I took of my STAG ar15. just got it like a week ago and shot it yesterday. I love this ****ing gun. I'll take some more pics whenever I get a chance...

[The Captain]

Originally Posted by garrettej8

here's a quick shot I took of my STAG ar15. just got it like a week ago and shot it yesterday. I love this ****ing gun. I'll take some more pics whenever I get a chance...

That gun + your avatar scare me.

[ITSTOCK]

Nicely done! And it looks familiar You'll love it, and it won't be the only one.

[ITSTOCK]

Hmmmm....looks like I'll be buying a few more guns this year at my current rate:

[alwaysinboost]

^^^ do you just like to collect guns like some people collect baseball cards or are you expecting to actually use some of those weapons to defend yourself if WWIII pops off?

Serious question because it looks like you have one hell of a stock pile of weapons, more then some 3rd world countries.

[OutOfStock]

Itstock, you are my hero

[ITSTOCK]

Originally Posted by alwaysinboost

^^^ do you just like to collect guns like some people collect baseball cards or are you expecting to actually use some of those weapons to defend yourself if WWIII pops off?

Serious question because it looks like you have one hell of a stock pile of weapons, more then some 3rd world countries.

...collect, well, trying. I'm more in to modern weaponry than the old WWII stuff (except I still need to pick up an M1a, practically unchanged throughout every variation in the past 50 years, and still widely used), and new guns rarely come out. It just amazes me how such a simple reaction is so complicated! This years to buy list was updated to FN FS2000, Bushmaser ACR (even though bushmaster is making it instead of magpul ), FN SCAR (do out 4th quarter of 08, expected 1st quarter 09), find a good deal on a slightly used or 2nd hand NIB SIG 556 (even though I passed on one already and sold it to my brother, I think they "feel" like junk, but they are smooth weapons), and one of the Steyr Aug copies, don't know which yet.

Some of the guns I have only have a hundred or so rounds through them, and others, I had my fun with and they were packed up along with ammo (for instance the PS90, it's in storage for good).

Not only do they interest me in the complex actions, but they are a great investment! Over the years, desirable guns have vastly outperformed the stock market. Plus, if God forbid the gov't decides to implicate another ban, at least I will have the chance to own them and keep them forever.

So collector (I wish I could be more of one!)/ investment purposes, plus just because I can. Trust me, my collection sucks compared to the majority out there! I was working at one of the executives of Wachovia in Villanova and no kidding, he had about 10,000 guns, worth well over a million dollars. Another collector is a big time commercial builder in the area and has a 2000 sq/ft HIDDEN BANK VAULT (the entire wall slides out to reveal a true bank vault door) in his basement, with about a million in guns. Someone with 1 F/A (NFA) gun can have as much in to the gun as I do my entire collection...often LOTS more. I wish I was rich!

[the mike]

Man, if you get an AUG, you'll be my hero. Having a P(S)90 and an AUG, it's like real life SOCOM 2!!


Seriously though, must be nice living in PA. I had to suck dick for an air rifle. I think I'll try to pick up an FN handgun this year, finances prohibiting.

[DoubleOughtCel]

Originally Posted by the mike

Seriously though, must be nice living in PA. I had to suck dick for an air rifle.

holy ****, mike. thanks for the new sig! hahahahahaah