My Experience with Verocious

[blowbyu24]

The “TEAM” at Verocious Motorsports

I am going to explain my experience with the shop in the best detail I can. Since my car is one of the top things I love in my life and can recall events when things happened.
Well it was the fall in 2006 when I called Andy at Xotic and told him I want him to be the proud builder of this set up that I have been saving for, for a long time. I told him after I graduate school in North Carolina I would like to bring my car to him. I shopped around and got all the parts needed with the help of Andy. I finally got everything together and planned with him to bring in the car. I dropped off my car off at Verocious Motorsports (Xotic got bought out) on May 9th, 2007 a Wednesday, my only source of travel, my only car! He said that it would take three weeks to tear the motor down put the new pistons, rods and bearings in along with porting the heads with new valves and retainers. So I planned on staying up in PA for the month and head back down to NC until the fall while I finished working at my job. Well the month went by and I had to head back down to NC with no car. My parents had to drive me down. I continued to wait and it finally took 3 months for them to complete the job. I wasn’t happy at all because they didn’t say 3 months, they said 3 weeks. I called the shop about once a week to check on the status and every time I left a message with the secretary and no one got back to me, worst customer service while this whole build was going on. Since the delay they bought back some of my stock parts to help off set the high bill, so that was nice and I had a good feeling when I went to pick it up. I got the car back the first week in July.

Well I get the car back and it seems to be running fine. When I get down to NC with the car I had a pretty big oil leak coming from the rubber hose that was cut and clamped back together with a metal pipe in between. I was breaking in the car and had set a date to get tuned by Andy. I set a date with them to go on the dyno July 21st. I call them the day before just to check in and get ready to head up after I reserved a trailer and barrowed a landcruser to take my car up to Verocious. Well I call up there and they say the dyno is broken and they don’t know when it’s going to get fixed. They didn’t even call me to tell me this I would have showed up at their doorstep probably and been denied after driving 9 hours if I wouldn’t have called. When i called that day Andy was supposed to call me back and set up a date to tune me....he never called me back...i waited a week and he never callled me so i decided to call Phil and when i set the day i posted it on the thread about my decision to have Phil tune it Andy pmed me on nasioc saying i see your having Phil tune the car...they never called me back to set a tuning date...great service, why do you think i went else where...i still have the pm saved

Well this was the last straw. I was so pissed that I called Phil @ Element and ask him to tune my car. I set a date with him on August 8th. This is the list of events when I get up to Maryland to get the car tuned. I showed up that day with another oil leak that had to be fixed so I couldn’t get tuned and had to stay over night in a hotel while Andrewtech tried to find the leak. They hooked up an oil pressure gauge and installed my second fuel pump that wasn’t wired in ($400) down the drain along with the hotel bill. The next day Phil is on the dyno and the car is not making power, were all stumped for why this is happening. Before we knew it the car spun a rod bearing after we put some c16 in to see the effects of some high octane and after almost 2,000 break in miles the motor is done.

I had to have Phil take me and the car up to Verocious again to have the motor inspected and get taken care of. They pull the motor and couldn’t find for why there was low compression and the rod bearing spun. Yes couldn’t find why. So what they are trying to say is that Phil with a oil pressure gauge didn't know what he was doing on the dyno. The oil pump was working and didn't fail on the dyno. The oil pump only failed after laying around in a shop for 6 months. Like my block that had to get re honed b/c there was rust in the cylinders from sitting around so long. But when they turn the new motor on the first time then they try to point fingers at Phil and I saying the bearing spun b/c of lack of oil, they didn't say that back in August...I want them to explain how all other bearings were in great shape but one managed to have oil starvation... Bull****, that pump did not fail on the dyno. Phil is one of the best tuners in the country, we wouldn't let that happen. Then onto the cams, they then said that they wanted to have the cams looked at and the rods looked at as well by Cosworth and Pauter. Andy said they were going to make this first priority at all my expense. It took me to call Andy and basically threaten him to do any kind of action and then finally he shopped agreed to pay for the labor and I pay for the parts, while I still felt was ****ty. It wasn’t my fault that the car lasted 2,000 miles, of break in miles, no boost!!

They took the motor apart and inspected it within a few days so by Monday August 13th we knew the motor was bad and the parts needed to be inspected. So this time around I thought I would give them some space to work on the car and get it done quickly!!

I finally moved up on September 22nd and the car still wasn’t done, they said the cams had to go back to Cosworth and that they just got back the rods from Pauter and they were fine. So three weeks went by they didn’t send out the cams.

The October rolls by and no word, they gave me some line of BS. Then all I want for my birthday on Nov 1st was my car back...No luck there. Then thanksgiving rolls by and they were still letting my car sit there. I think purposely if you ask me. Finally it’s the last few days in November and they finally told me that they shipped out the cams. So from around August 13 to Dec 1st they didn’t do anything!!!!!! Why I don’t know why!!

So I call them up saying that they have to pay for the whole bill or else there is going to be legal problems, well this incident finally gets the attention of the owner and now he is trying to make things right. Then they ship out the cams and say they will cover the whole cost…that’s the least that they could do…damn right it was

They ship out the cams and Cosworth says there fine, they put them back in the car and test the compression and it was low like the first time. They put stock cams back in and the compression bumps back up so they send the cams back again and finally Cosworth sends new ones and the compression is fine after installing the new cams. This is now the middle of January 2008, yes 2008.

---side bar--- I believe the first time that I got my motor back they didn’t even do a compression test, so the day I picked up my car in July the compression was probably low, I don’t have evidence but I would bet my life on it that they didn’t check it, because after the motor was rebuilt they were having compression problems, like it was the first time that they came across of this------

So finally January 21st rolls around they say the car will probably be done and I go down there and they are having problems with the hydra, so I wasn’t able to pick it up that night. I go down the next night and pick it up with it still not working I was so pissed and stressed out over this 6 months that I couldn’t sleep at night and have been very very depressed.

I take the car home to find out that it was still on the C16 map, so I drove home 2 ½ hours on a race gas map with good old 93 oct. in it. Thank god I didn’t see any boost on the ride home. The reason I didn’t see any boost was b/c there was a vac leak and the hydra locked the boost with I picked it up from Verocious. I stopped on the way home to get gas and I could hear the leak, so when I got home I looked at the motor. By the time I got home the car was running terrible. I had to change the spark plugs because they got fouled out from running so rich when there was a boost leak and it locked the boost/vacuum line. After I fixed that and the spark plugs, I got a base map from Phil and the car started running fine until there was misfiring going when it got into boost.

So I had to take it down to Phil and have him check out what was going on. Because I never want my car to go back to VEROCIOUS ever again!! We take the kick plate out and the hydra wires look like spaghetti, like they crammed all the wires in there, no wonder why the hydra was acting funny, the hard drive was messed up because it was crammed under the kick plate. Well a compression test was done and there was 25% compression in cylinder #2. So just a few days ago the motor was taken apart and found out that the hone was too aggressive and the piston to wall clearance was wayyy tooo loose and the block is useless for oem size pistons. The ring gaps were way too loose and couldn’t handle the distance and didn’t seat and was leaking compression when the test was done AFTER ONLY 900 MILES. That’s right two motors built by Verocious that couldn’t make it past break in miles. 900 miles and their “correctly spec-ed motor was shot!!!

So I brought you up to speed, it is now April 1st, 2008

Now I am left with a broken motor and wasted 11 months of my life and now I have to pay to have a brand new motor put together, not only did I waste my time with having Verocious build the motor again I am going to be out at least ANOTHER $5,000!!!!

ALL ALONG WITH THIS BEING MY ONLY CAR…….


Summary
First motor, low compression and spun rod bearing after 2,000 miles
Second motor lasted 900 miles, specs were off and block is ruined
Shop took 10 months to build 2 motors that were both bad

[Jeffros Spec V]

Since this already has two threads dedicated to it I'll just say sorry to hear about your troubles with Verocious.

[Honest_Bob]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. I cant believe your doing all that work to your daily driver. Your ****ing crazy.

[teh DIRT]

What were your piston to cylinder wall clearances?

[DaveSTi]

This is why people who seriously modify their cars have daily drivers.

Sorry to hear about your bad experience with Verocious. Spend that $5k on a daily.

[~Brian~]

Hey Cole, glad you could make it to the site!

Just saw you in the isle a few minutes ago. haha

Glad to hear that your getting the suby back next week though, cant wait go for a ride in this monster!

[blowbyu24]

Originally Posted by teh DIRT

What were your piston to cylinder wall clearances?

ill be able to get all the info once i pick up the car

Originally Posted by DaveSTi

This is why people who seriously modify their cars have daily drivers.

Sorry to hear about your bad experience with Verocious. Spend that $5k on a daily.

yes, it will no longer be my daily driver once i get it back, my intentions were to save for another car once i got it back, but so far i have had to put all of my money towards the set up!!

Originally Posted by Snowboy459

Hey Cole, glad you could make it to the site!

Just saw you in the isle a few minutes ago. haha

Glad to hear that your getting the suby back next week though, cant wait go for a ride in this monster!

you know it!!

[///chrism3]

good thing i didnt let my m3 go to them...well wait it couldnt have since im still waitin on my custom trubo that andy was gettin together...3-4 months later still ahvent heard from him....sooo fck them

[Seven]

[james_ls]

Cough cough R/T FTW.

[evomike]

Seriously this is what happens sometimes when you modify a car, shops build many cars at once so things tend to take a bit longer. I have no clue if you got screwed or not, but modifying a car never goes perfect. I mean it sucks and all but I'm sure there is a lot to the story , and I'm sure you being mad never helps things but hey it is what it is right.

[The Captain]

Originally Posted by evomike

Seriously this is what happens sometimes when you modify a car, shops build many cars at once so things tend to take a bit longer. I have no clue if you got screwed or not, but modifying a car never goes perfect. I mean it sucks and all but I'm sure there is a lot to the story , and I'm sure you being mad never helps things but hey it is what it is right.

This might be what happens when an beginner mods a car, but this should not happen when someone pays top dollar for a professional shop to do the work. You are paying for a reason, so it can be done right. Yes, things tend to be delayed at shops, understandably so, but this time frame seems a little ridiculous. However, i don't know both sides of the story, so i can't make any judgment. BUT if this happened the way it is said, i'm sure verocious would want to rectify this because bad publicity for a shop can hurt in the future 100 fold. Good customer service goes very far.

[Verocious]

Originally Posted by ///chrism3

still waitin on my custom trubo that andy was gettin together...3-4 months later still ahvent heard from him....s

Alex, one of the owners handles all the scheduling, and co-ordinating of work in the shop, which also would include developing an estimate for you.

If you need a quote for a custom turbo set-up, he would be glad to meet with you to discuss your goals and options for getting there. He's in the office M-F 9-7 you can call him or shoot him an email at service@verociousmotorsports.com

Regards,
Tim

[Verocious]

Originally Posted by The Captain

This might be what happens when an beginner mods a car, but this should not happen when someone pays top dollar for a professional shop to do the work. You are paying for a reason, so it can be done right. Yes, things tend to be delayed at shops, understandably so, but this time frame seems a little ridiculous. However, i don't know both sides of the story, so i can't make any judgment. BUT if this happened the way it is said, i'm sure verocious would want to rectify this because bad publicity for a shop can hurt in the future 100 fold. Good customer service goes very far.

We have no further comments regarding the build listed above. The customer has a thread documenting the project in another forum.

[Ender81]

Originally Posted by Verocious

We have no further comments regarding the build listed above. The customer has a thread documenting the project in another forum.

Not to annoy anyone in this thread, and despite Verocious refusing to comment here more fully, I felt compelled to find the build thread and read it to get the whole story and see if there was more to it. That thread can be found here http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1251701
and the response from Verocious is found there on page 21, post 505 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=505


On a little sidenote you said this was your only car and how you have been without a car, on page 11 in your thread you posted this:

alright guys i need your help...now that im back up north i will not have to use this car everyday...should i just put in like 105 or 110 oct and run that all day long that or should i run 93oct and then every once and a while run c16.....i want to run c16 b/c it would be able to hit that 600whp mark, but i know i won't be able to with just 105- 110oct....but how great would it be to run 110 and be at 550whp all day long...let me know your suggestions!!


So do you live really close to your job, work at home or do you have a second car, girlfriend start driving you around? Not being an ass just curious, I went without my car for two weeks and it drove me nuts, now I am getting a beater lol.

[05Accent]

that sucks!!

[blowbyu24]

Originally Posted by Ender81

Not to annoy anyone in this thread, and despite Verocious refusing to comment here more fully, I felt compelled to find the build thread and read it to get the whole story and see if there was more to it. That thread can be found here http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1251701
and the response from Verocious is found there on page 21, post 505 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=505


On a little sidenote you said this was your only car and how you have been without a car, on page 11 in your thread you posted this:

alright guys i need your help...now that im back up north i will not have to use this car everyday...should i just put in like 105 or 110 oct and run that all day long that or should i run 93oct and then every once and a while run c16.....i want to run c16 b/c it would be able to hit that 600whp mark, but i know i won't be able to with just 105- 110oct....but how great would it be to run 110 and be at 550whp all day long...let me know your suggestions!!


So do you live really close to your job, work at home or do you have a second car, girlfriend start driving you around? Not being an ass just curious, I went without my car for two weeks and it drove me nuts, now I am getting a beater lol.

hey ill give you the run down...when i moved back up north i am now living with my g/f and our work is only 10 mins apart and we car pull...she said that we could use her car more often now that this whole thing has went down and i want the motor to last longer.....plans are to have just a pump gas and a race gas tune, race gas for the track when i go and pump gas for everyday driving..its more than likely its gonna be a semi DD....yeah sucks having no car and having to bum your g/f's car

[lagos]

Well, it sounds like you got the old mechanic run around.
If they tell you a week, expect a month. If they tell you a month, expect a year.

But besides that, you have to realize that sh!t just happens when working on cars. A lot of people think that building a motor is like going in to have new brake pads installed. They expect it to be done asap, and never to have any problems with it again. Sadly, it just doesn't work like that. If you want things done right, do them yourself. You'll save a lot of money and learn about how long these types of projects really take.

[ej20wrx123]

Originally Posted by The Captain

This might be what happens when an beginner mods a car, but this should not happen when someone pays top dollar for a professional shop to do the work. You are paying for a reason, so it can be done right. Yes, things tend to be delayed at shops, understandably so, but this time frame seems a little ridiculous. However, i don't know both sides of the story, so i can't make any judgment. BUT if this happened the way it is said, i'm sure verocious would want to rectify this because bad publicity for a shop can hurt in the future 100 fold. Good customer service goes very far.

^x2
One thing i found very upsetting in blownbyu's nasioc thread is that he needed his cams sent back to the manufacturer and verocious dragged their feet for month(s) before they even MAILED them out. To me that sounds like either very very poor shop managment or them just being flat out dicks.

[///chrism3]

Originally Posted by Verocious

Alex, one of the owners handles all the scheduling, and co-ordinating of work in the shop, which also would include developing an estimate for you.

If you need a quote for a custom turbo set-up, he would be glad to meet with you to discuss your goals and options for getting there. He's in the office M-F 9-7 you can call him or shoot him an email at service@verociousmotorsports.com

Regards,
Tim

tryed that..thought everything was good and he was to find parts a few weeks later i contacted u guys agian and got a lil update then contacted again got nothin and then again u guys were still searchin and havent heard since...sorry but the widebody M isnt coming to your shop..too much money in my car for me to get fcked over and have damage happen or even lose parts..you guys do do some good work not gonna lie about that but ur customer serive need some work