Anyone running E85 ?

[tort9320g]

I'm thinking of converting to E85 and i'm trying to find out the pros and cons. I run 32 psi on the street on a mix of Sunoco 93 plus a big shot of methanol and it doesn't do it for me. Running around on C-16 just isn't practical. Thinking E85 might be the answer. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks...Dave

[screamingdsm]

I have looked into e85, from what i get you gotta double your fuel system. Like no less the 1000cc injectors and a walbro 255hp just cuts it. Its definatly worth it. I dont think there is any cons to it. I am thinking about switching also. Lots of guys making good power on it.

[screamingdsm]

If you replace a few components in your fuel system, you can run E-85 forever with no problems. Items required to run E-85 properly.

1. 33% larger injectors - Ethanol tolerant
2. 33% larger fuel pump - Ethanol tolerant
3. Anodize fuel rail (or get ethanol tolerant one)
4. Ethanol tolerant FPR
5. SS fuel line from tank to fuel rail
6. Ability to control fuel -DSMlink, SAFC, AEM

There are a few people on here that run E-85 daily with no problems. And a few people in CO have converted their WRXs to E-85. Now going on something like 10,000 miles with no ill effects.

Besides it's over 100 octane and it's cheaper than running race gas, so why not.

By the way, it's safe to run up to 23% E-85 with no ill effects no matter the age of your car. Cars made after 1988 can handle even more than 23%. Usually up to 30% without getting a CEL. All you ever wanted to know about E-85 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

[screamingdsm]

and another perfect one

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/show...&highlight=e85

[Verocious]

The main draw backs to E85 are that it is very hydroscopic and the ethanol is corrosive. It is highy recommended that any aluminum that E85 will contact be anodized. The longer it sits in the tank, the more water it will absorb also. I dont know the long term effects on rubber, but I would assume that will eventualy dry the rubber out. You do need to go larger on the fuel injectors also. 1000cc will make 550-600whp without too much of an issue. I recommend a minimum of two walboros also if not a large external pump will be required. A buddy of mine has a EG hatch with a 2.1 liter tuned on E85. His car traps at 140mph+, and that is his street tune. As long as you can get E85 on the regular, I say go for it. My next car will be tuned on E85. I am lucky enough to have an E85 pump really close. I also just like when people ask "why does his car smell funny?"

Support a farmer, burn his crops!!!!!

[AjRose]

I wish e85 was more readily available around here

[redline]

Originally Posted by Verocious

The main draw backs to E85 are that it is very hydroscopic and the ethanol is corrosive. It is highy recommended that any aluminum that E85 will contact be anodized. The longer it sits in the tank, the more water it will absorb also. I dont know the long term effects on rubber, but I would assume that will eventualy dry the rubber out. You do need to go larger on the fuel injectors also. 1000cc will make 550-600whp without too much of an issue. I recommend a minimum of two walboros also if not a large external pump will be required. A buddy of mine has a EG hatch with a 2.1 liter tuned on E85. His car traps at 140mph+, and that is his street tune. As long as you can get E85 on the regular, I say go for it. My next car will be tuned on E85. I am lucky enough to have an E85 pump really close. I also just like when people ask "why does his car smell funny?"

Support a farmer, burn his crops!!!!!

Good info. Ethanol murders rubber seals and gaskets. You will need all rubber gaskets or O-rings made out of Neoprene. I have converted a few dispensers to E-85. It is very corrosive stuff.

[TurboGSR96]

Originally Posted by Verocious

The main draw backs to E85 are that it is very hydroscopic and the ethanol is corrosive. It is highy recommended that any aluminum that E85 will contact be anodized. The longer it sits in the tank, the more water it will absorb also. I dont know the long term effects on rubber, but I would assume that will eventualy dry the rubber out. You do need to go larger on the fuel injectors also. 1000cc will make 550-600whp without too much of an issue. I recommend a minimum of two walboros also if not a large external pump will be required. A buddy of mine has a EG hatch with a 2.1 liter tuned on E85. His car traps at 140mph+, and that is his street tune. As long as you can get E85 on the regular, I say go for it. My next car will be tuned on E85. I am lucky enough to have an E85 pump really close. I also just like when people ask "why does his car smell funny?"

Support a farmer, burn his crops!!!!!

I know who you are talking about, car scares the **** out of me on an 80 roll, I will be getting tuned in a month or so on E85, the stuff is amazing. Some Honda Guys are cracking 700 with the stuff pretty easy now. I am running 2 walbro's, -8 to the rail and 1000cc's looking to make 700.

[wgknestrick]

Originally Posted by redline

Good info. Ethanol murders rubber seals and gaskets. You will need all rubber gaskets or O-rings made out of Neoprene. I have converted a few dispensers to E-85. It is very corrosive stuff.

I don't know of any modern O-rings made out of "rubber" any more. Most are either Buna-N or Viton, both which are Ethanol compatible. I think this has been a scare tactic by big oil to spread some mis-information out about E85.



PolyEurethane, Silicone, and Polyacrylate are the O-ring materials that can't hold up to it, and they aren't very common.

[capitalcrew]

Originally Posted by screamingdsm

If you replace a few components in your fuel system, you can run E-85 forever with no problems. Items required to run E-85 properly.

1. 33% larger injectors - Ethanol tolerant
2. 33% larger fuel pump - Ethanol tolerant
3. Anodize fuel rail (or get ethanol tolerant one)
4. Ethanol tolerant FPR
5. SS fuel line from tank to fuel rail
6. Ability to control fuel -DSMlink, SAFC, AEM

There are a few people on here that run E-85 daily with no problems. And a few people in CO have converted their WRXs to E-85. Now going on something like 10,000 miles with no ill effects.

Besides it's over 100 octane and it's cheaper than running race gas, so why not.

By the way, it's safe to run up to 23% E-85 with no ill effects no matter the age of your car. Cars made after 1988 can handle even more than 23%. Usually up to 30% without getting a CEL. All you ever wanted to know about E-85 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85

I thought you needed new 02 senors too..

[347gtvert]

lancaster has many gas stations w/ e85. give it another 2 years, it will be local.

[Sleeper]

Yea thats the thing. Availability. Ive been wanting to run this for years now. Ya know what really pisses me off though. When you're at the pump, it says 10-15% ethanol added now but they still charge us for the volume of gasoline! Prick bastard oil companies.

But Yea tort, the above info is correct. I would recommend going with 1600cc injectors with your setup. You may have some issues with cold starting until you find the appropriate loading at starting cycles (when cold) but once you find it, you'll have no problems. let me know if there is some place where this becomes available cause I will definately be switching

[SovXietday]

There's a 700whp GSR I running E85 somewhere around Philly I believe, car is redonculous.

I've been waiting for it to come more readily available. I'm tired of 93 lol.

[james_ls]

Originally Posted by SovXietday

There's a 700whp GSR I running E85 somewhere around Philly I believe, car is redonculous.

I've been waiting for it to come more readily available. I'm tired of 93 lol.

Find it so I can excrement in mah' draws.

[NOPSTNS]

dont wquote me but isnt e85 terrible on fuel economy? like for maths sake if a 20 mpg 200 hp car switches to e85 it will get 13 mpg and make 180 hp.....

anyone ever heard this? i had a friend do a report on e85 when i was in tech school, we had to talk about alternate fuels, my report was on hydrogen but his was e85. if i remember correctly of what he said, was that the emissions is very clean and the resistance to burn is very high (high octane in a nutshell) but i think he said its thermal efficiency or some crap was terrible. like cars would loose 30% thier mile per gallon and the hp would drop a small bit on a stock car.

am i wrong here? correct me if i am, bc im not sure....

[1988 Olds]

Gas mileage is worse but as far as HP goes, I believe it increases. My dad's dragster engine went from about 700hp to 730hp from going to 110 to Alcohol.

[Nick 95 6sp]

I think the most common power increase you get by using E85 is that on a boosted car, you can safely run higher boost than you can with 93 pump ...meaning you can crank up the boost without getting knock/detonation and without having to pull a ton of timing. On an NA car, the only way I see you can get more power would be from increasing compression ratio (not exactly easily adjustable for most people) but you also get more charge-air cooling since the alcohol part of E85 has more cooling effect (latent heat of vaporization) than gasoline, so with a cooler charge it is more dense so you can cram more fuel in with the air and more air and fuel is more power.

Originally Posted by capitalcrew

I thought you needed new 02 senors too..

You don't need new or different O2 sensors but you have to realize that what the typical standard O2 sensor is telling the ECU is not the same as if you are burning gasoline. For example, on my wideband (FJO using an NTK sensor) you can select the "lambda" parameter to either gasoline, methanol, or anything else you might want to burn and this will make the O2 output more useful for controlling air/fuel ratio ...and another factor to know is that the "optimum" a/f ratios for E85 (or methanol) are different than they are for gasoline. Fortunately, there seems to be a growing body of knowledgeable tuners who know how to tune cars to run safely on E85.

[wgknestrick]

Originally Posted by NOPSTNS

dont wquote me but isnt e85 terrible on fuel economy? like for maths sake if a 20 mpg 200 hp car switches to e85 it will get 13 mpg and make 180 hp.....

anyone ever heard this? i had a friend do a report on e85 when i was in tech school, we had to talk about alternate fuels, my report was on hydrogen but his was e85. if i remember correctly of what he said, was that the emissions is very clean and the resistance to burn is very high (high octane in a nutshell) but i think he said its thermal efficiency or some crap was terrible. like cars would loose 30% thier mile per gallon and the hp would drop a small bit on a stock car.

am i wrong here? correct me if i am, bc im not sure....

Yes it is true that your MPG will drop. It is mostly because of the energy content per gallon is less compared to normal gas.

[capitalcrew]

Ahh, alright. Thanks for clearing that up Nick.

[1adam12]

Tort!!! Where u been.. its freemer.. steve showed me this forum, more time to waste now