engine swap vs turbo

[xEJ20x]

Originally Posted by Greddy2000Civic

I put that in my previous post, if you know the right people a b18c1 swap could cost 1500$ for everything including install...I wish I had the money cause I know I have the Honda friends

Not everyone has decent enough connections.
And I was saying $5,000 for the JDM B18C motor.

[capaGC8]

IMO you should never turbo a car that is NA from the factory, but since the D16 engine has such low compression and is very stout it would be a nice app for boost. i wouldnt plan on running anything more than 7-8psi on a stock block unless you don't care if it blows.

on the other hand, a nice NA motor making good power and maybe even a LSD would make a great daily driver that wouldnt give you the headaches a boosted NA car would. just think how much money you would be putting into the boosted car in order to keep it running and compare that the price of a low mileage, high HP NA motor swap that would run for a long time with no issues.

it's definitely going to cost you more than $600-$800 in the long run...

[xEJ20x]

Look into the latest Sport Compact Car magazine.
They talk about piecing together a junkyard turbo kit for a Civic.

[D Money]

Originally Posted by SexyScionTC

If you search on Turbod16.com, there is a guy named rota runing in the 10s with a fully built motor and a gt35rs...I think he said he is runing 21 psi and has about 420 hp... yeah I know i was shocked too man, I didn't realize SOHC's were that powerful!

Ill make sure to get right on that!!!

[HatchSurfer3]

Originally Posted by screamingdsm

if your running a 35r,im hoping theres somekind of stand alone involved,and big injectors,in that case you should be able to work out a .63 a/r turbine housing and get full boost at 4200 or so,and thats a estimate,might be lower.Lag is a figure of speach.I mean if you try to lay into it in 4th gear at 2k its gonna lag,but thats why you have the option to down shift.It comes down to how much usuable rpm you have.I mean if boost comes on at 4200...where can you take the car out too,8 8500.Thats gives you around 4000 rpms of usuable power

anyone running more then like 5 lbs of boost should have upgraded injectors and new fuel management no matter what kind of turbo it is, even a little 15g

[07BlackSS]

Heres the deal. Anything over 5 psi on a stock d16 must have some kind of management unit (SAFC or VAFC are ok) and bigger injectors (DSM 450's are the favorite). What I am going to be runing is 10psi and when you get any higher than that, then it is suggested you go with a Stand Alone System, which I will be sporting. I have seen numerous times d16 engines runing 14 psi fine on a stock block(these were beatin on daily for years and still work ok... yeah i know its crazy what these things can withstand). The whole thing that makes this work is the low compression and a good tune. I know a good bit about this ****, but Igo4BMX has a little bit more info on this subject...So if you could back me up that would be great!

[2point4DSM]

Originally Posted by capaGC8

IMO you should never turbo a car that is NA from the factory

I've argued against this many times when someone use to consider adding a turbo to a 1g DSM with a 2.0 motor. The NA version came with the exact same block, crank, rods, and heads as the turbo version. The difference is weaker, higher compression pistons, smaller injectors, different ecu, lack of piston oil squirters and cams. But adding a small turbo to one is relatively cheap and in the long run can benefit from much lower insurance premiums when compared to a turbo model.

Obviously, the turbo model will have a lot more potential. But sometimes those different parts get changed in the faster cars anyway. So why not start with a car with a cheaper vin.

Too bad there are no NA, AWD models or I would have gone that route a long time ago.

[awdlaserbeam]

if anyone is going to need injectors i have a set of 1g stock injectors laying around . . .

[07BlackSS]

Hey, civic boy if you want to turbo jump on these injectors, they are kinda hard to find at a cheap price. I got mine for 20$ and thats a very good price, you can usually find them for over 50$ on ebay or other spots.

[LSHatch]

Originally Posted by capaGC8

IMO you should never turbo a car that is NA from the factory,

Tell that to the S2k making 500whp on a stock block.

Or the numerous GSR's running in the 400whp range.

[CHR!S]

Originally Posted by LSHatch

Tell that to the S2k making 500whp on a stock block.

Or the numerous GSR's running in the 400whp range.

or a 700whp h22 powered ek that is also daily driven on lower boost

[HatchSurfer3]

yea and esmith from this board is puttin out very good numbers on his 03 si stock block...i dont remember exactly what, but he might be puttin out like around 300 whp, someone back me up on that tho

[CHR!S]

Originally Posted by HatchSurfer3

yea and esmith from this board is puttin out very good numbers on his 03 si stock block...i dont remember exactly what, but he might be puttin out like around 300 whp, someone back me up on that tho

im pretty sure it is 300whp. his car is truely badass even though its only has a turbo kit

[On Sale]

Originally Posted by MuddyREX

I think Sav at Impo ran his SOHC motor into the 9s.

in 2000 he had the worlds fastest SOHC honda.... so yea, im sure you can make a SOHC fast as balls . lol and if you want to, just ask sav what he did.

[capaGC8]

Originally Posted by LSHatch

Tell that to the S2k making 500whp on a stock block.

Or the numerous GSR's running in the 400whp range.

Originally Posted by CHR!S

or a 700whp h22 powered ek that is also daily driven on lower boost

and how many of them are daily drivers?

[LSHatch]

Every single one.

[igo4bmx]

Originally Posted by 2point4DSM

For every 1 bar of boost the power gained is equivalent to adding another motor to your car. What this means is if you have a 2.0L motor and run 14.7 psi of boost then it effectively makes the motor act like a 4.0L motor. 29.4 psi is like running a 6.0L motor.

The reason 2.0L turbo 1g DSMs were right on par with 5.0L mustangs back in the day. So you will gain more power from boosting your motor than by increasing displacement a little bit.

i'd have to disagree Wil...
power from boost is primarily dependant on air flow.
I've seen a 300 whp LS motor make that power only on 8 lbs and then again Maurice's friend made 295 whp on 17 lbs of boost.

[igo4bmx]

Originally Posted by capaGC8

and how many of them are daily drivers?

Geoff from full race has a daily driven civic that just dyno'd over 850 whp... but its actually a secret for now

[07BlackSS]

Originally Posted by igo4bmx

I've seen a 300 whp LS motor make that power only on 8 lbs and then again Maurice's friend made 295 whp on 17 lbs of boost.

Isn't that the because of the size of the turbo?

[igo4bmx]

Originally Posted by Greddy2000Civic

Heres the deal. Anything over 5 psi on a stock d16 must have some kind of management unit (SAFC or VAFC are ok) and bigger injectors (DSM 450's are the favorite). What I am going to be runing is 10psi and when you get any higher than that, then it is suggested you go with a Stand Alone System, which I will be sporting. I have seen numerous times d16 engines runing 14 psi fine on a stock block(these were beatin on daily for years and still work ok... yeah i know its crazy what these things can withstand). The whole thing that makes this work is the low compression and a good tune. I know a good bit about this ****, but Igo4BMX has a little bit more info on this subject...So if you could back me up that would be great!

wrong...
any type of positive pressure will kick the MAP sensor CEL and the car will go limp...

you go really lean when in boost with a stock ecu too

safc and vafc are a bad idea on a honda for fuel management, since when you run boost down in low rpms in high gear, your tps is higher and timing is advanced.... KABOOM

there are several 300 whp stock motor d series... but not that many, and I consider them miracle motors...

lower compression is always a plus since you increase the room for "error" for bad fuel... bad timing...