The Official 2009 Philadelphia Phillies Season Thread

[4DR_DB7]

FYI - Brown, as in Dominic Brown (iirc) is considered the Best prospect in their farm system by many many scouts. When you have a stacked team like they already have, you don't make a drastic move like that. Getting Halladay doesn't guarantee a repeat any more than not getting him locks you out of one.

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

FYI - Brown, as in Dominic Brown (iirc) is considered the Best prospect in their farm system by many many scouts. When you have a stacked team like they already have, you don't make a drastic move like that. Getting Halladay doesn't guarantee a repeat any more than not getting him locks you out of one.

It doesn't garentee another ws championship but it surely makes you the favorite. With our offense and a back to back Cole and Roy pitching gives us the best chance.

Who cares about the future. With our players now we have a great chance to win at least one more in two years. I don't know about you but last time I checked the object in baseball is to be the number one team not to just make the playoffs and not win while your window of opportunity is open.

I'd rather keep Happ and give them everyone else since he's proven he can pitch in the bigs and no one else is proven yet. I'm guessing that may be what the Pedro move is for. Maybe Myers will come back and go to the pen. Who knows. I just want them to take the St. Louis series today because everyone has been making a huge deal about them since the trade.

[4DR_DB7]

we are already the favorite. The Phils are just reaching their potential now. Last year was kindof a fluke, now everyone is really playing well and the pitching has come together. Again, we shouldn't be so desperate/greedy. we just won the series last year. If we don't win it this year, its okay! I'd rather keep the talent we have and make a run for the next 5-7 years, then go-for-broke this year. Being the favorite doesn't mean jack.

don't get me wrong, I would LOVE to have Halladay, but the Jays are asking for way way too much. If this was last year, I'd say "of course make the trade". But with the way they are playing now, everything is clicking... you don't make a move like that that could potentially upset the balance of the team and rock the boat. Just go with it man!...

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

we are already the favorite. The Phils are just reaching their potential now. Last year was kindof a fluke, now everyone is really playing well and the pitching has come together. Again, we shouldn't be so desperate/greedy. we just won the series last year. If we don't win it this year, its okay! I'd rather keep the talent we have and make a run for the next 5-7 years, then go-for-broke this year. Being the favorite doesn't mean jack.

don't get me wrong, I would LOVE to have Halladay, but the Jays are asking for way way too much. If this was last year, I'd say "of course make the trade". But with the way they are playing now, everything is clicking... you don't make a move like that that could potentially upset the balance of the team and rock the boat. Just go with it man!...

We are very far from the favorite. For the NL East yeah anything after that nothing. Dodgers are tearing it up and the Yankee's are just as hot as we are now. The A's are on fire now too.

Pitching is doing a little better. It's still not great or as good as it was last year. You do realize once the playoffs come pitching is more important then anything. It's also not hitting season anymore and balls won't fly out as much. This nucleus is going to be together for two more seasons after this. It's time to go for broke. Prospects will always be there. How do you think the Yankees and Red Sox do it? For that 3-7th year you're talking about it's not going to be even close to the same team. Howard will probably be gone to an Al team to dh, Rollins probably won't be resigned since he's getting up there in age, Raul will be 40, and hopefully Chase will be one of the lifers. That would be nice. If we don't get him Cliff Lee is nice as a second starter. I've heard they are looking at getting Arizona's closer for the pen and I'm sure just in case Lidge implodes like he's been doing.

[4DR_DB7]

"Far from the favorite"????? WTF man, cut us some slack. We are defending Champs! Dodgers had the better record last year too, and we whooped em. Heck, I don't need to win the series last year. I am satisfied, so long as they make the playoffs and do their best. It is fun watching them now, that is all that matters to me (now that we won a championship).

Pitching this year is def better than last year. Hamels isn't doing as well, everyone else is playing better. If anything, Happ and Blanton and Madson and Romero have one more year of experience under their belts. We didn't lose any pitchers, save for myers who isn't that good anyway, so how could the pitching be worse this year?

And yes, some players are getting old and expensive, thats why its important to keep these young guys that are going to be studs. It kills me when I see Scott Rolen and JD Drew having great careers elsewhere, I don't want to lose anymore future allstars like that. Jason Donald is being groomed to step in for Rollins, and along with Dom Brown, they have Michael Taylor to come in and play outfield, along with Mayberry. At this point, I'd rather trade Werth or Ruiz or even Rollins and let one of these young guys step up.

Like I said, I would like Cliff lee, but don't give up solid young talent for him, not 3 players at least. We just brought in one of the most dominant pitchers of your lifetime in Pedro, lets at least let him get back into shape and see what he can do before making another drastic move. Remember, Chan Ho has been pitching much better and he could easily fill in as a starter too.

If they were slumping right now, my opinion could be different...

Originally Posted by Supraru

We are very far from the favorite. For the NL East yeah anything after that nothing. Dodgers are tearing it up and the Yankee's are just as hot as we are now. The A's are on fire now too.

Pitching is doing a little better. It's still not great or as good as it was last year. You do realize once the playoffs come pitching is more important then anything. It's also not hitting season anymore and balls won't fly out as much. This nucleus is going to be together for two more seasons after this. It's time to go for broke. Prospects will always be there. How do you think the Yankees and Red Sox do it? For that 3-7th year you're talking about it's not going to be even close to the same team. Howard will probably be gone to an Al team to dh, Rollins probably won't be resigned since he's getting up there in age, Raul will be 40, and hopefully Chase will be one of the lifers. That would be nice. If we don't get him Cliff Lee is nice as a second starter. I've heard they are looking at getting Arizona's closer for the pen and I'm sure just in case Lidge implodes like he's been doing.

[BoostedG]

Phillies need to make the trade for Roy Halladay.Getting Roy Halladay makes us the team to beat. Rigth now Cardinals are the team to beat after getting Matt Holliday.I know Jays are asking alot, but they gotta do it.

Around the Majors quote from MLB

"Halladay update: After early in the day it became evident the Phillies wouldn't part with both prospect Kyle Drabek and Major League starter J.A. Happ. But Jays assistant general manager Tony LaCava scouted the latest outing of Phillies pitching prospect Carlos Carrasco, who could possibly be substituted for either Happ or Drabek in a deal. Meanwhile, FOX Sports is reporting that the Angels are intensifying their efforts, joining the Rangers, Brewers, Dodgers, White Sox, Red Sox and Rays that have been mentioned as showing interest in trading for Halladay, who is signed through 2010."

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

"Far from the favorite"????? WTF man, cut us some slack. We are defending Champs! Dodgers had the better record last year too, and we whooped em. Heck, I don't need to win the series last year. I am satisfied, so long as they make the playoffs and do their best. It is fun watching them now, that is all that matters to me (now that we won a championship).

Yes we are the defending champs. That does not mean we are the favorites. And no the Dodgers didn't have a better record last year.

2008 Phillies 92-70
2008 Dodgers 84-78

They are one of the more fun teams to watch because they score so much and there are so many threats.

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

Pitching this year is def better than last year. Hamels isn't doing as well, everyone else is playing better. If anything, Happ and Blanton and Madson and Romero have one more year of experience under their belts. We didn't lose any pitchers, save for myers who isn't that good anyway, so how could the pitching be worse this year?

Dude what the hell are you smoking? Did you actually watch baseball last year? Starting Pitching was towards the better half all year long, The bullpen was the best in the majors, and do you not remember that Lidge did not blow one save all year long?

How many has he blown? Starting pitching has come around but is 22nd in all of the MLB in era. Myers was awesome last year. Started out horrible went to the minors to work on his mechanics and was lights out the second half of the season. We don't have a number two starter. All of that is how pitching is worse this year.

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

And yes, some players are getting old and expensive, thats why its important to keep these young guys that are going to be studs. It kills me when I see Scott Rolen and JD Drew having great careers elsewhere, I don't want to lose anymore future allstars like that. Jason Donald is being groomed to step in for Rollins, and along with Dom Brown, they have Michael Taylor to come in and play outfield, along with Mayberry. At this point, I'd rather trade Werth or Ruiz or even Rollins and let one of these young guys step up.

Scott Rolen was traded away because he was a dump player for us to try to rebuild the organization. It was either that or wait till he was in free agency and get nothing for him when we were just horrible. JD Drew if you don't remember didn't wanna sign here so he never did. Is this your first year watching the Phillies?

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

Like I said, I would like Cliff lee, but don't give up solid young talent for him, not 3 players at least. We just brought in one of the most dominant pitchers of your lifetime in Pedro, lets at least let him get back into shape and see what he can do before making another drastic move. Remember, Chan Ho has been pitching much better and he could easily fill in as a starter too.

If they were slumping right now, my opinion could be different...

What you're not getting is once your in the Playoffs you have to have pitching. You can't win without it.

Pedro might do good, might get injured, or might just suck. Who knows. He was so cheap why not give him a try. Chan Ho will only be a long reliever. You start plugging pitchers everywhere you're asking for trouble. Kinda like when Lidge was out and they moved Madson to closer. He couldn't get the job done even though he's nasty as a set up man. We'll make a couple moves to better our team before the deadline. If not later in the waiver period.

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by BoostedG

Phillies need to make the trade for Roy Halladay.Getting Roy Halladay makes us the team to beat. Rigth now Cardinals are the team to beat after getting Matt Holliday.I know Jays are asking alot, but they gotta do it.

Around the Majors quote from MLB

"Halladay update: After early in the day it became evident the Phillies wouldn't part with both prospect Kyle Drabek and Major League starter J.A. Happ. But Jays assistant general manager Tony LaCava scouted the latest outing of Phillies pitching prospect Carlos Carrasco, who could possibly be substituted for either Happ or Drabek in a deal. Meanwhile, FOX Sports is reporting that the Angels are intensifying their efforts, joining the Rangers, Brewers, Dodgers, White Sox, Red Sox and Rays that have been mentioned as showing interest in trading for Halladay, who is signed through 2010."

Dude sorry the Cardinals are not the team to beat. Right now in the Nl it's still the dodgers followed by the Phillies. Holliday makes the Cardinals better but not better then us. We are closer to a .600 win percentage and the Cardinals are still closer to .500.

I don't listen to the reports. Some of it is stuff Toronto releases and some the Phillies releases to play with each others heads. Seriously Richardi throws out the Mets interest? He said that trying to get the Phillies to give him anything so the mets dont' get him. The Mets have no farm system and no money. Hell the owner lost 700 million to that guy who frauded everyone. These kind of games are played every year.

[4DR_DB7]

whatever you say geniusboy. FYI - having discussions with people who think they are absolutely right about relative, OPINION-BASED subjects like "who is the team to beat" = FTL.

Until someone knocks us out, we are the defending champs, and thus the team to beat. If we had acutally lost someone (I'll take Ibanez over Burrell any day) from last year, then you could argue the team is not as good, but we are CLEARLY better than last year. Just be satisfied. I dont' think Ruben Amaro is going to make moves based on what Supraru on TST insists is the right move. :D

EDIT: We just schat on the Cards 9-2 today. These games aren't even close. No reason to hit the Panic/Trade Button.

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

whatever you say geniusboy. FYI - having discussions with people who think they are absolutely right about relative, OPINION-BASED subjects like "who is the team to beat" = FTL.

Until someone knocks us out, we are the defending champs, and thus the team to beat. If we had acutally lost someone (I'll take Ibanez over Burrell any day) from last year, then you could argue the team is not as good, but we are CLEARLY better than last year. Just be satisfied. I dont' think Ruben Amaro is going to make moves based on what Supraru on TST insists is the right move. :D

EDIT: We just schat on the Cards 9-2 today. These games aren't even close. No reason to hit the Panic/Trade Button.

You said dodgers had a better record then the Phillies last year, proved you wrong.

You say the Phillies pitching staff is better then last year. I didn't post up the facts but if you would like me to I will. Our Pitching was pretty good all year and lights out the second half of the year. So if you want me to post some links I will prove you wrong. This one is a no brainer if you've watched them the last two years not just watch the sports center updates.

You tried to say we dumped two really good players when one never wanted to sign here and went somewhere else and the other we weren't even close to contending so we traded him away by request. Why do you think we always boo him when he's up? Why do you think we threw batteries at JD Drew? Fans don't do that if the organization trades them away, only comes when they want out.

And please do not make me bring up the 5 links about tires having a break in period. I just provide facts I don't talk out my ass.

Everything I have said has been factual, not just you're lame idea of what's going on. Right now we are playing awesome and I'm hoping they keep doing it. Another thing you don't know is the Phillies second half records since Charlie has been here are all over .500 by a pretty good amount. We're a second half team. So leading the division by 3 games at the all star break is a really good sign for us.

You could at least make sense on what your arguing here. I don't know why you're talking about the team to beat when I said in the Nl the dodgers and the Phillies are the teams to beat, not the Cardinals. And when was I talking to you about what moves Ruben needs to make? Basically you didn't rebut anything I said to you and came up trying to defend stuff I wasn't even discussing with you. Have you graduated high school yet? You don't make sense.

[SpEcRv9]

Originally Posted by Supraru

You said dodgers had a better record then the Phillies last year, proved you wrong.

You say the Phillies pitching staff is better then last year. I didn't post up the facts but if you would like me to I will. Our Pitching was pretty good all year and lights out the second half of the year. So if you want me to post some links I will prove you wrong. This one is a no brainer if you've watched them the last two years not just watch the sports center updates.

You tried to say we dumped two really good players when one never wanted to sign here and went somewhere else and the other we weren't even close to contending so we traded him away by request. Why do you think we always boo him when he's up? Why do you think we threw batteries at JD Drew? Fans don't do that if the organization trades them away, only comes when they want out.

And please do not make me bring up the 5 links about tires having a break in period. I just provide facts I don't talk out my ass.

Everything I have said has been factual, not just you're lame idea of what's going on. Right now we are playing awesome and I'm hoping they keep doing it. Another thing you don't know is the Phillies second half records since Charlie has been here are all over .500 by a pretty good amount. We're a second half team. So leading the division by 3 games at the all star break is a really good sign for us.

You could at least make sense on what your arguing here. I don't know why you're talking about the team to beat when I said in the Nl the dodgers and the Phillies are the teams to beat, not the Cardinals. And when was I talking to you about what moves Ruben needs to make? Basically you didn't rebut anything I said to you and came up trying to defend stuff I wasn't even discussing with you. Have you graduated high school yet? You don't make sense.

x100000000

lol @ trying to say our pitching is better this year than last year..

lol @ bringing scott rolen and jd drew up as well...nothing like bringing up a player we had 5 years ago and a player we never had while we were turrible, hey why not bring up Jim Thome while we're at it?

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by SpEcRv9

x100000000

lol @ trying to say our pitching is better this year than last year..

lol @ bringing scott rolen and jd drew up as well...nothing like bringing up a player we had 5 years ago and a player we never had while we were turrible, hey why not bring up Jim Thome while we're at it?

I'm always up for a good debate but gotta at least have the facts strait.

[doug]

Phils trade Carrasco, Knapp, Donald and Marson for Cliff Lee and Ben Francisco.

[crazy2sin]

Very nice trade ... get to keep happ, drabek, and taylor

[ozthunder]

Fleeced them. Plain and ****ing simple. Fleeced them.

[4DR_DB7]

Originally Posted by doug

Phils trade Carrasco, Knapp, Donald and Marson for Cliff Lee and Ben Francisco.

DUMB! Carasco I'm fine with, Knapp I have no idea who that even is.

Donald is your future shortstop/2nd base/utility infielder and Marson was all ready to step up and be the missing element, a good all-around catcher who actually hits the ball pretty well... at the least a awesomely solid backup to Ruiz....

If it were for Halladay, it would be one thing, Cliff Lee is not going to improve our team that much, and Francisco isn't even going to play.

I really don't know where we suddenly got this desperate "we still need another pitcher besides Pedro" frantic mantra....

Hate to say so, but if we don't win it all now, I'm going to throw this trade back in everyone's face as a complete waste of young talent.

[doug]

holy crap debbie downer..

[silver01lude]

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

If it were for Halladay, it would be one thing, Cliff Lee is not going to improve our team that much, and Francisco isn't even going to play.

How do you figure that? He won the Cy Young last year, and he has a lower ERA than 4 of our 5 starters, including our Ace, more K's than any pitcher on our staff, and hes pitched almost 40 innings more than any other starter on our team. That kinda endurance will work wonders for our bullpen, which is overworked as it is.

[doug]

That's what happens when people talk out their butt cheeks.

[Supraru]

Originally Posted by 4DR_DB7

DUMB! Carasco I'm fine with, Knapp I have no idea who that even is.

Donald is your future shortstop/2nd base/utility infielder and Marson was all ready to step up and be the missing element, a good all-around catcher who actually hits the ball pretty well... at the least a awesomely solid backup to Ruiz....

If it were for Halladay, it would be one thing, Cliff Lee is not going to improve our team that much, and Francisco isn't even going to play.

I really don't know where we suddenly got this desperate "we still need another pitcher besides Pedro" frantic mantra....

Hate to say so, but if we don't win it all now, I'm going to throw this trade back in everyone's face as a complete waste of young talent.

Dude you're proven lack of knowledge of anything and in this case baseball is hilarious. Donald is easy to get rid of. There will be other prospects before jimmy is out of here and we can always pick one up. People wanna actually play here for the first time in a long time. Lou was nice but what no one seems to realize is Ruiz is a great catcher. He's one of the tops defensively and he really knows how to call a game and work with the pitcher. Offensively he could be better but also does anyone else remember how good he was in the world series? Hell if Cole lost one game he easily would have been the Mvp oddly enough. You keep Ruiz for his defense.

Lee isn't going to improve your team? He won a cy young award last year. He's hovering around a 3.00 era and once you shoot over to the Nl that will drop into the 2's. That pretty damn good. Hell nimbers wise he should be the ace compared to Hammels year. Fransisco is a great bat off the bench. Better then Bruntlet who's hitting a cool .127 or something like that and over the outfielder (my mind is drawling a blank)

Dude you've proved you can't throw anything in anyones face because you have no clue what you're talking about. When you barely even watch the Phillies that doesn't mean you now know a lot about baseball and other teams players in general.