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Old 07-01-2005, 02:56 PM   #21
FeeJ
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why are you yelling at him?? hes not doing it to your car hes doing it to his own car wityh his money...
so if you dont like just say I think ur wasting ur money but gl and dont blow urself up or understeer into a tree due to the weight distribution

the 'R' in RX-7 stands for rotary, so most rotary owners are a bit opposed to the swap, as a new owner of an FC I'd prefer a 13BT in the FB or something like that, but he claimed price and whatnot in the first post which is very reasonable to stay away from teh wankel.

the weight distribution fight, yeah mnootors are heavy, but the placement of the motor in the RX's are what gave it the good distribution, the motor is completely behind the front axle making it front-mid mounted.

at least hes not worrying about voiding a warranty or some crappy lil mod like a bolt on intake like a lot of people are so confused about on these boards. If it ends up being a mistake he'll learn in the end and the hard way

GL to you again in producing an extremely rare LS1 FB, mae sure to post pics along the way so we can follow up on its development and make sure you get it done
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Old 07-01-2005, 11:37 PM   #22
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I wasn't yelling at him, I just gave him my opinion and reasons for it. If he only wanted agreement then he would/should have asked for that.

To the kid in the neon, shut up. There is no information is worse than wrong information (your specialty apparently). I also like it when it's not coming out of someone's ass, rather someone with experience.

- A 13bt is NOT 400lbs. (weigh one and tell me)
- An LS1 WILL throw off the balance of the car
- Your mother was a lizard (I won't call you stupid anymore if you can tell me what movie that was from)
- Ellis Jaun is NOT an improvement in an rx7.
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Old 07-02-2005, 12:14 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mazda6guy
Yeah a nice combo with the FD is the LS1 motor. I just love that rotary sound especially when it is a turbo rotary. Well if my FB was a 13B I would not think of this conversion. Just think it is cheaper to do a v-8 coversion than a 13B turbo conversion for my FB. The only thing that I hate about rotaries is that they are really exspensive. :thumbdow:
I would hardly call rotaries expensive. Whats expensive is all the custom stuff your gonna have to do to fit that ls1 in there, and then when you shoot a piston out of that aluminum block, fabbing everything back to put in a rotary again, thats when it gets expensive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverTurboRidin
Hardly, They are some of the real street killer's.
Thats cool, the one v8 rx7 I every came across, ran a 15.3 and it had trouble beating my old na rotary

Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
Rotaries are heavy motors. You DO know this right?

Putting in an LT1 or LS1 will hardly hurt the handling. A lot of guys who have done the swap actually like the handling better with the Chevy.
Heavy compared to what? A lima bean? I have held every part of a rotary engine in my hands, this includes the rotors, housings, exhaust mani, upper and lower intake mani's, turbo, and eccentric shaft. Those parts dont add up to 400 lbs. I have also pushed a S4 13bt and a 13brew accross the floor of a shop. I weigh 145 lbs soaking wet and I didnt have any problems. IMO they weigh about 200 lbs(these were complete motors btw)

Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
The TII 13b weighs in around 400lbs, while the LS1 almost hits 500. So a 100lb difference in the front which can easily be counteracted. Battery moved to the rear, fiberglass hood, take out all unnecessary parts. You end up with a car that has much more potential and reliability. The car ends up only being about 30-40 lbs heavier in the nose. Not too shabby.
Read above statement. A stock t2 hood is fiberglass. So good luck shaving the weight down there. Taking out all unnecessary parts, that would include the ls1, that would shave alot of weight off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverTurboRidin
you also get a car that with enough weight reduction will lift the front tires lol
You can do that with a rotary with no weight reduction. I've seen it so dont try to disprove me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazda6guy
Experience has shown that the stock NA RX-7 components are strong enough to withstand low 10sec 1/4mi passes, a feat that requires around 500hp. Now does this sound GAY?

No, it sounds wrong.
Let me expand on this a little bit. Go to any rx7 forum and ask how much power the stock na tranny can handle. They will tell you this: "barely more then stock". Swapping in a stock s4 t2 motor (which has 182 hp and 183 torque) will destroy that tranny.
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Old 07-02-2005, 12:19 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FeeJ
why are you yelling at him?? hes not doing it to your car hes doing it to his own car wityh his money...
so if you dont like just say I think ur wasting ur money but gl and dont blow urself up or understeer into a tree due to the weight distribution

the 'R' in RX-7 stands for rotary, so most rotary owners are a bit opposed to the swap, as a new owner of an FC I'd prefer a 13BT in the FB or something like that, but he claimed price and whatnot in the first post which is very reasonable to stay away from teh wankel.

the weight distribution fight, yeah mnootors are heavy, but the placement of the motor in the RX's are what gave it the good distribution, the motor is completely behind the front axle making it front-mid mounted.

at least hes not worrying about voiding a warranty or some crappy lil mod like a bolt on intake like a lot of people are so confused about on these boards. If it ends up being a mistake he'll learn in the end and the hard way

GL to you again in producing an extremely rare LS1 FB, mae sure to post pics along the way so we can follow up on its development and make sure you get it done
And so there is no confusion I am not yelling at anybody, I am just correcting the wrong statements. It is his money and he can do what he wants with it. And good luck to him, if he ever wants to sell it, I wont buy it.
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Old 07-02-2005, 12:39 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mazda6guy
The rotary engine's eccentric shaft centerline is way up in the center of the rotary engine, dictating a much higher transmission location than that of a piston engine.
Wow...........Tri-state tuner, huh? I hope the only thing your tuning in your car is the radio.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mazda6guy
Experience has shown that the stock NA RX-7 components are strong enough to withstand low 10sec 1/4mi passes.
A (single) experience . . . in a go-kart, maybe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverTurboRidin
, Thank you!!! I knew you were a smart cookie like myself! LOL
"LOL" huh, you weren't the only one laughing after you said that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverTurboRidin
Quote:
Originally Posted by sPrSw2o
v8 rx7's are GAY.
Hardly, They are some of the real street killer's.
Yeah, I bet you're running into them ALL the time.




Yes, you can remove accesories and do other things to shave weight after a v8 swap to get closer to their original weight. You can also do the same things to a stock-engined car and be lighter still....so that is hardly a valid argument for the swap.

You guys talking about the "minor" difference in the weight of an ls1 versus a 13bt need to remember that its not only WHAT the weight is but it's also WHERE the weight is.

Hold a 5 lb. dumbell next to your shoulder for five minutes....cake.....now hold it an arms length away.....not so cool. Would you rather play a football game with 5 lbs. on each ankle, or 10 lbs. on your back? Crude analogy, but it illustrates the idea.
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Old 07-02-2005, 04:26 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4

Heavy compared to what? A lima bean? I have held every part of a rotary engine in my hands, this includes the rotors, housings, exhaust mani, upper and lower intake mani's, turbo, and eccentric shaft. Those parts dont add up to 400 lbs. I have also pushed a S4 13bt and a 13brew accross the floor of a shop. I weigh 145 lbs soaking wet and I didnt have any problems. IMO they weigh about 200 lbs(these were complete motors btw)


Read above statement. A stock t2 hood is fiberglass. So good luck shaving the weight down there. Taking out all unnecessary parts, that would include the ls1, that would shave alot of weight off.
My comments come directly from my buddy who has a V8 RX-7. He said the Rotary was heavy for how small it is. My weight came from some site online. I wasn't sure of the weight, so I looked it up.

The argument of reliability is still valid here though. I don't trust rotaries, I've seen too many break at the track, online, wherever. I still haven't personally seen an LS1 take a **** on someone when the motor was pushed. The same can't be said of any rotary motor.

I still don't see why some of the rotary guys hate the V8 conversion so much. It's a car, and someone puts a different motor in it of their choosing. Who cares? It's like the guys that cry about swapping the F20 out of my car for something else, since it's the VTEC god to some of the dorks out there. Whatever happened to custom fabbing mounts and putting the V8 set back farther. Therefore, pushing that weight back again and getting closer to a better weight distribution. Anything can be done if you have the know how and equipment...or money.
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Old 07-02-2005, 09:43 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch

My comments come directly from my buddy who has a V8 RX-7. He said the Rotary was heavy for how small it is. My weight came from some site online. I wasn't sure of the weight, so I looked it up.

The argument of reliability is still valid here though. I don't trust rotaries, I've seen too many break at the track, online, wherever. I still haven't personally seen an LS1 take a *no cursing!* on someone when the motor was pushed. The same can't be said of any rotary motor.

I still don't see why some of the rotary guys hate the V8 conversion so much. It's a car, and someone puts a different motor in it of their choosing. Who cares? It's like the guys that cry about swapping the F20 out of my car for something else, since it's the VTEC god to some of the dorks out there. Whatever happened to custom fabbing mounts and putting the V8 set back farther. Therefore, pushing that weight back again and getting closer to a better weight distribution. Anything can be done if you have the know how and equipment...or money.
heavy for its size? its cast iron.

you just had three ppl explain why a lot of rotary owners hate the v8 swap. and we all said, "its your car, good luck". we told you flaws in the swap, we did not say not to do it.

the only lt1 rx7(fc) i've seen, the engine WAS mounted at the back of the engine bay. but it still FILLS the engine bay. Therefore, still moving weight up and forward.
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Old 07-02-2005, 10:27 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by sPrSw2o
heavy for its size? its cast iron.

you just had three ppl explain why a lot of rotary owners hate the v8 swap. and we all said, "its your car, good luck". we told you flaws in the swap, we did not say not to do it.

the only lt1 rx7(fc) i've seen, the engine WAS mounted at the back of the engine bay. but it still FILLS the engine bay. Therefore, still moving weight up and forward.
Ok, so they hate V8 swaps because it puts the engine up forward and messes up the weight bias of the car. I understand that, but many things can be done to counteract any of that. i.e. New swaybars, stiffer springs, removing unneeded weight from the front.

The RX7 I know of is running an older carbed 350. The motor sits pretty far back and doesn't seem to stick over the front cross member that much.

There may be flaws in the swap, but there are also flaws with keeping the Rotary. It really depends on what you want.
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Old 07-02-2005, 11:38 AM   #29
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BTW To the poster who said his Stock N/A would keep up with a V8 powered rex i find your full of ****. Two people i know have now done the LS1 swap one went a little more drastic. First time at the track he ran a 12.1

The other guy who had his car prepped for 10's ended up only hitting 11.23

And yes V8 powered RX-7's are around, Just come to the car show's or hell go to some of the shop's i goto...you'll see.
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Old 07-02-2005, 12:38 PM   #30
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I have a friend at Clemson who did the swap with a 302. His web site is: http://www.uglyduckracing.net/

Who says V8 rx7's can't be fun, watch some of his videos.
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Old 07-02-2005, 01:25 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4

Heavy compared to what? A lima bean? I have held every part of a rotary engine in my hands, this includes the rotors, housings, exhaust mani, upper and lower intake mani's, turbo, and eccentric shaft. Those parts dont add up to 400 lbs. I have also pushed a S4 13bt and a 13brew accross the floor of a shop. I weigh 145 lbs soaking wet and I didnt have any problems. IMO they weigh about 200 lbs(these were complete motors btw)


Read above statement. A stock t2 hood is fiberglass. So good luck shaving the weight down there. Taking out all unnecessary parts, that would include the ls1, that would shave alot of weight off.
My comments come directly from my buddy who has a V8 RX-7. He said the Rotary was heavy for how small it is. My weight came from some site online. I wasn't sure of the weight, so I looked it up.

The argument of reliability is still valid here though. I don't trust rotaries, I've seen too many break at the track, online, wherever. I still haven't personally seen an LS1 take a *no cursing!* on someone when the motor was pushed. The same can't be said of any rotary motor.

I still don't see why some of the rotary guys hate the V8 conversion so much. It's a car, and someone puts a different motor in it of their choosing. Who cares? It's like the guys that cry about swapping the F20 out of my car for something else, since it's the VTEC god to some of the dorks out there. Whatever happened to custom fabbing mounts and putting the V8 set back farther. Therefore, pushing that weight back again and getting closer to a better weight distribution. Anything can be done if you have the know how and equipment...or money.
My comments come directly from me, not some guy who feeds me information that I post on the internet to sound smarter(ohh wait, that kinda describes you doesnt it?) The weight I said comes from experience. You dont trust rotaries, then dont buy one and you wont have to worry about it. As far as rotaries breaking, they do break, but so do all other motors. Ive seen a STOCK LS1 shoot a piston through its block.

When did I say i hate the v8 conversion. I DONT CARE WHAT HE DOES WITH HIS CAR!!!!! I wished him good luck. The only reason I came in here is because there are idiots like you spreading around wrong information. Push it back as far as possible and the weight distrubution still wont be equal to the rotary powered rx7.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
There may be flaws in the swap, but there are also flaws with keeping the Rotary. It really depends on what you want.
How are there flaws with keeping the rotary? The car was designed for a rotary engine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverTurboRidin
BTW To the poster who said his Stock N/A would keep up with a V8 powered rex i find your full of *no cursing!*. Two people i know have now done the LS1 swap one went a little more drastic. First time at the track he ran a 12.1

The other guy who had his car prepped for 10's ended up only hitting 11.23

And yes V8 powered RX-7's are around, Just come to the car show's or hell go to some of the shop's i goto...you'll see.

Wow you are an idoit. Look at what you have contributed to this thread. Absolutly nothing. My na fc was a real street killer. haha When did I ever say my old na was stock. There are more v8's then just you precious ls1. It was a mustang motor. It ran a 15.3 I ran a 15.7 I had a 3 tenths better reaction time then him so we were door to door the whole lenght of the track. He had trouble beating my old na(which wasnt stock).
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Old 07-02-2005, 01:44 PM   #32
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Yeah but how many people are really going to bother with an old 286 (thats what it was right?) if they're going to swap in a v8? Probably not too too many . . .

I can't recall myself, FC3S4, or sprsw2o having ever said a v8 rx7 couldn't make a fast drag car. They aren't just talking about drag racing.

I don't know why any of you v8 guys haven't brought up any of the pro's of the swap instead of arguing that the cons don't really exist.

With the right v8 you could have similar fuel consumption to a 13bt with more bottom end torque, predictable and immediate throttle response, and smooth power delivery (no sudden rush of boost). A v8 rx7 would probably feel a bit quicker in day to day driving. There are a lot more shops out there qualified to work with most v8's than there are people to work on rotaries (i.e. more convienant). Maybe you do your own work and prefer to work with v8's, maybe you prefer the exhaust sound of a lopey v8 to a John Deer on crack, maybe you want to make 400hp and dont feel like deeling with what a rotary needs to run there safely....yada yada yada.....

Those are all valid points (to which I'm sure others will give good counter points *ahem* sprsw2o, fc3s4 *ahem*)...so why are we still talking about weight? You pro-v8 guys can't win that argument.

Sorry to flip-flop between sides, but the v8rx7 wasn't quite getting a fair trial here (inadequate representation).
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Old 07-02-2005, 03:11 PM   #33
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I have a friend at Clemson who did the swap with a 302. His web site is: http://www.uglyduckracing.net/
cool stuff
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Old 07-02-2005, 05:11 PM   #34
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Nice vid of the 302 powered FB.
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Old 07-02-2005, 05:31 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4
My comments come directly from me, not some guy who feeds me information that I post on the internet to sound smarter(ohh wait, that kinda describes you doesnt it?) The weight I said comes from experience. You dont trust rotaries, then dont buy one and you wont have to worry about it. As far as rotaries breaking, they do break, but so do all other motors. Ive seen a STOCK LS1 shoot a piston through its block.

When did I say i hate the v8 conversion. I DONT CARE WHAT HE DOES WITH HIS CAR!!!!! I wished him good luck. The only reason I came in here is because there are idiots like you spreading around wrong information. Push it back as far as possible and the weight distrubution still wont be equal to the rotary powered rx7.

How are there flaws with keeping the rotary? The car was designed for a rotary engine.

My info doesn't come from "some guy". He is my good friend, I was there while he did some of the swap. It's not some guy I just talk to. So your arrogant comment about me trying to sound smart on the internet just flew out the window. Get the stick out of your ass and chill out. This is a discussion, not a cry baby argument.

I have yet to spread any misinformation. I've posted ideas and counterarguments. Not just "oh the weight gets shifted forward, so it sucks." Like I stated, which is FACT, that can easily be counteracted with proper suspension setups.

My flaws, as stated if you actually would read are the reliability of the rotary, especially once they get heavily modded. So, before you come at me with personal attacks, why don't you actually read what has been posted. Thanks.
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Old 07-02-2005, 07:07 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
My info doesn't come from "some guy". He is my good friend, I was there while he did some of the swap. It's not some guy I just talk to. So your arrogant comment about me trying to sound smart on the internet just flew out the window. Get the stick out of your ass and chill out. This is a discussion, not a cry baby argument.

I have yet to spread any misinformation. I've posted ideas and counterarguments. Not just "oh the weight gets shifted forward, so it sucks." Like I stated, which is FACT, that can easily be counteracted with proper suspension setups.

My flaws, as stated if you actually would read are the reliability of the rotary, especially once they get heavily modded. So, before you come at me with personal attacks, why don't you actually read what has been posted. Thanks.

Your exact words were "my comments come from my buddy". Your "buddy" could be some little punk that cant even change his oil for all i know. So as far as im concerned he is "just some guy".

You have yet to spread any misinformation? You were the person that said that a rotary engines weight was 400lbs, which is wrong. Your ideas are wrong (remember replacing the fiberglass hood with a fiberglass hood? Yea good idea.)

OK now on to your flaws. Contrary to popular belief rotary engines can be very reliable to those that know what they are doing. And about how the extra weight of the ls1 can be counteracted by proper suspension setups. This is true, but an rx7 with a rotary inside will handle better than a v8 rx7 simply because ITS LIGHTER.

You can stop trying to save what little dignity you have left, that is unless you want me to beat it into the ground like i did with the rest of your "facts" and "ideas".
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Old 07-02-2005, 08:15 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4
bicker bicker bicker
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
argue argue argue
am I the only one seeing this too??

not to pick on you 2, but its a trend im seeing

I think this thread needs to get locked if it doesnt start to become productive, we all know the basics of the big motor swap in place of the rotary, and what it causes in the characteristics of the car, yes the V-8 will make it heavier and throw the weight balance forward, yes it is more power reliably than a 13BT
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Old 07-02-2005, 08:20 PM   #38
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i find it hard to believe that this extreme change in weight distr. and center of gravity can be "easily" counteracted. suspension mods are avialable regardless of whether its still got a rotary or not. this means that the v8 rx7 will always be the inferior handling vehicle. tons of companies have spent tons of money into finding good rates, ride heights, swaybar stiffness, etc... for a rotary powered rx7. how many companies have done real test + tuning for an ls1 equipped rx7?

your modifying the cars suspension to try to return it to the handling capability to that of a stock rx7. this must be done b4 the car makes any step forward in the handling area. IMO, this is gay.
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Old 07-02-2005, 08:49 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FeeJ
Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4
bicker bicker bicker
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSHatch
argue argue argue
am I the only one seeing this too??

not to pick on you 2, but its a trend im seeing

I think this thread needs to get locked if it doesnt start to become productive, we all know the basics of the big motor swap in place of the rotary, and what it causes in the characteristics of the car, yes the V-8 will make it heavier and throw the weight balance forward, yes it is more power reliably than a 13BT

Its all in good fun
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Old 07-02-2005, 08:50 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC3S4



Your exact words were "my comments come from my buddy". Your "buddy" could be some little punk that cant even change his oil for all i know. So as far as im concerned he is "just some guy".

You have yet to spread any misinformation? You were the person that said that a rotary engines weight was 400lbs, which is wrong. Your ideas are wrong (remember replacing the fiberglass hood with a fiberglass hood? Yea good idea.)

OK now on to your flaws. Contrary to popular belief rotary engines can be very reliable to those that know what they are doing. And about how the extra weight of the ls1 can be counteracted by proper suspension setups. This is true, but an rx7 with a rotary inside will handle better than a v8 rx7 simply because ITS LIGHTER.

You can stop trying to save what little dignity you have left, that is unless you want me to beat it into the ground like i did with the rest of your "facts" and "ideas".
A lot of people on here know my "buddy who can't change his oil."

I didn't just quote that the motor weighed 400lbs. A website that sold rotary blocks did. So, cry to them.

I never said that an LS1 would handle better then a rotor powered rx. So, once again, stop the diareah of your mouth and putting it into mine. Thanks.

Save my dignity? Hahaha. Oh yeah, I'm really getting schooled here.
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