Dave's 2017 Camaro Fifty SS
 

I spent months researching 997 911S cars and to get a great one, it kept me looking in the $55-60k price range. That's fine and dandy, but not when you're also carrying a GTI payment and you can't truly DD a 911 unless you don't care about it getting banged up a bit.

I decided to take a step back and really look at owning 2 cars and my lifestyle. I decided that 1 car would be so much easier to manage as well as free up a metric **** ton of cash a month that I could use to buy a house with a garage.

Enter in the 2016 Chevy 20% off sticker event with $5k cash down on the hood in the DC area. It got me looking at the Camaro, but finding a 2SS model with the Bose stereo, navigation, heated and cooled seats, blind spot tech, etc etc was hard. I found ONE, but it was sold before I could get to the dealer. That lucky bastard. (nothing like buying a brand new car at Black Book values).

After test driving one without mag ride or the NPP, I liked it but didn't want to settle on ANY options. If I was going to take a step back from a 911, it needed to have EVERY SINGLE OPTION I WANTED.

Enter a 2017 2SS Fifty Year Anniversary edition.

Pros:
Its loaded with creature comforts for my daily commute in DC traffic.
It's as fast as a 997.1 GT3
It has selectable drive modes that control the adjustable mag ride and exhaust system
No IMS bearing, RMS leaks, lifter issues, bore scoring or D-Chunks.
Latest and greatest in-car tech (4G LTE WIFI, Apple/Android/etc)
It's cheap to fix/upgrade
It has a warranty
It's "cheap"
It's a Corvette/ATS with a backseat and trunk
It's the fastest new car for the money

Cons:
It's big
It's 3700lbs
The standard seats aren't great with lateral support
It comes with the mullet history attached to the brand name


6.2 liters, 455hp, 455 torque, 0-60 in 4.1 seconds, 115mph-118mph in the quartermile, big Brembo brakes and magnetic shocks with a TR6060 manual transmission.

I liken it to the last gen AMG C63 with the 6.3liter with bad seats. The Mustang is the E92 M3 with bad shocks.

Drives smaller than it is the more seat time I have, the steering is the best of the electrics i've had, the blind spots aren't as bad as the magazines say, fuel economy is as good as the 911, and I can either go Chevy Malibu mode while sitting in traffic, or Track mode and bang gears out with the exhaust wide open.

Pics incoming.



Mods Planned:

- 1LE Wheels and Tires
- GM Performance 6-Piston Front Brake Kit
- Ported heads and custom cam
- Kooks 2" Longtube headers with high flow cats/x-pipe
- DSX Flex Fuel kit
- Custom Tune

Mod List:


Engine:
- GM Performance Cold Air Intake (tune included)
- Katech ported throttle body
- PRAY ported intake manifold
- HPTuners changes to a few tables

Transmission:
- 1LE Short Throw Shifter

Brakes:

Suspension:
- 1LE F/R Swaybars
- 1LE Springs
- 1LE MRC Valving
- 1LE Rear Trailing Arms
- GM Performance Strut Tower Bar

Wheels:


Interior:
- GM Sport Pedal Kit
- GM Cargo Net
- GM Fifty Floormats
- ZL1 Start Button

Exterior:
- Black Bow Ties
- GM Dark Tail lights
- ZL1 1LE Dark 3rd Brake Light
- Diode Dynamics LED smoked side markers
- Big Worm Graphix smoked vinyl rear light kit
- GM Rear Splash Guards

this forum really has gone downhill fast with all this camaro talk

2 threads in 1 day ?

i wish you the best of luck

almost every person i know that went to a domestic muscle car from a german car has went back.

at 20% off expect black book to tank very quickly (its already happening)

We're moving this forum upmarket

Thank you

I know the depreciation on a new car is bad to begin with. The Camaro is right around 38%, which is horrible, but I'm also saving a substantial amount of money each month with the purchase. I'll have to hold onto it longer to get out of the negative equity, but it's not a financial burden or hardship.

If the car falls apart, so be it. Most likely will only have it until the warranty ends.

I tend to trade in and out of cars yearly, if i keep this one two years or three years it'll be a surprise.

What's fun about the car is that it's my first GM product and my first American car since 2005! The quality has come a long way since the late 90's/early 2000's.

Picture time!

Fifty year anniversary edition adds some styling features to the regular SS. The 2SS package is where I feel like the car justifies the price tag a bit.

https://c4.staticflickr.com/6/5612/3...ffb63e0f_z.jpg

https://c1.staticflickr.com/6/5705/3...fd25261a_z.jpg

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Mixes in alcantara/suede inserts on the doors and center tunnel with stitched leather pieces throughout the door panels, steering wheel, and seats. Seats are a mix of suede and leather. aluminum trim on the doors and shifter console.

Stitched leather on the dash trim. The only two places I can find cheap plastic in the interior are the dash left of the gauges and the shifter surround, but they are textured well.

700 miles and the ride is quiet without creaks or rattles (i know they will be coming). The magnetic shocks really smooth things out but the car doesn't flop around in turns. Odd combination to feel. shifter is precise..not as rifle bolt as the 911 but cleaner shifting than the GTI by far. Clutch is nicely weighted without being tiring and the steering really is better than expected for an electric rack.

Everything feels right in terms of build quality. Switches, buttons, interfaces all feel like they have some substance to them, nothing is going to break off in my hand.

I write that and then immediately think of the latch to move the seats forward to gain access to the backseat shelf. That does appear to be cheap compared to the 911 or GTI.

Trunk opening surround plastic is kind of cheap but not an area that matters much. Rest of the car has been solid. Can tell the difference in plastic grain between the Chevy and the germans but its not a show stopper or unworthy of the price point.

Overall, the car just offers a ton of content for a good price. Not too cheap that it'll attract the wrong crowd to the car, but not too expensive to make you question what you've purchased.

The biggest surprise is that despite the car having literally every option in the tech world, it lacks rain-sensing wipers and adaptive cruise control. Kind of odd considering all of the blind spot/parking technology.

Not sure how I missed this...

This is... uhh... different. I completely understand why you did what you did (look at why I did what I did...) and I'm kindaaaa wondering if I should have done something similar (slightly cheaper but way more powerful Mustang...)

Congrats on the new car, Dave!

Thank you! I know this is out of left field for me, as i'm not a typical muscle car guy.

I've driven the 2015+ Mustang GT w/ Performance Pack and Recaro seats(and regular seats) for quite a bit (2-3 hours of seat time due to a lot of test drives).

The Camaro beats it as a performance car by a noticeable margin.

I would say that if you really want a platform to modify a ton, then the Mustang is the way to go. If you want something better sorted out of the box, then the Camaro with Mag Ride and NPP is the way to go (1LE is the ideal if you can live without blind spot technology).

I'm at 1200 miles now and can say the car is faster through turns than my old 911 thanks to mag ride and more tire contact patch. It's much faster in a straight line, has better brakes and can hold a line at significant speed for a factory car. The weak link has to be the seats and I could definitely go for the 1LE method of more tire and suspension.

Aside from that, it's aesthetic preferences and interior design and storage. The Mustang wins that part, but I'd argue having the TR6060 transmission is worth not having much of a back seat. :)

For the money, can't beat these two cars right now. Especially with Chevy's 0% for 72 mos, or 20% off plus cash back deals right now.

Interesting comparison with the 911. I assume it rides WAY better than the 911 S too?

The current crop of muscle cars are great for the enthusiast. They're all pretty good (though Dodge is lagging and needs an update to cut weight ASAP) and really pushing the prices lower which is awesome.

Well, I'll just say it: No car I've had is as dialed in as the 997 era 911. It reads your eyes and mind on what to do next. Just supernatural ability despite its power and limits with the factory hardware.

I would love to still have one and hope to get one again someday. It's just that good.

Ride comfort, I would say the Camaro mag ride is better than the S suspension. The shocks are a couple generations ahead of where the S shocks were in 2005. Damping is better with bumps in the road on full stiff and there's a much more solid "platform" to the suspension. It's also a weird feel. Comfort that feels like rocking you around but the car stays FLAT.

Yeah, Ford and Chevy really hit it out of the park this generation. I liken the two cars to an E92 M3 and a last gen C63. They don't have the premium cabins or seats but I will say that the steering feel is definitely better.

Top Gear on the 1LE / Camaro:

http://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/c...to/first-drive

On a track in Mexico, I've gotten the car to boogie about 2-3 mph faster through a familiar turn than my 911....with the suspension in Touring mode (softest).

Thanks for the feedback on the differences. The magride stuff is awfully impressive.

Anytime! The mag ride makes the car...I test drove one without it and while it was good, it wasn't great.

In Track mode, the 2-3 mph faster in the turns than the 911 is even higher, but I'll need more chances to really figure it out.


I do think the 1LE parts will find themselves on my car in the future.

The 1LE package is a steal for the performance offered. Hopefully GM prices the parts as ridiculously cheaply as Ford does, haha.

What tires are on your SS?

Every time I look at that first pic of your car I picture a transformer, lol. Also, get rid of that dealer sticker ASAP :)

haha, that's the beauty of Chevy and Ford...factory parts are so damn cheap. I've heard $1500 for the 1LE suspension upgrade since it would just require springs, swaybars and bushings and a new software tune for the shocks.

Wheels are wider too, which I'd need. My factory wheels are 20" x 8.5" front and 20" by 9.5" rear. 1LE bumps that up to 20" x 10" front, 20" by 11" rear.

The 6 piston front brakes are offered as an optional upgrade on the SS. $2200 is the cheapest i've found and includes the calipers, brake pads, lines and two piece rotors with mounting hardware. The difference I believe is 40mm?

The short shifter will be $350 or so. I've heard replacing that is a pain to do.

The Recaro seats I'll snag used, but I don't want to ruin my interior either so that'll be a game time choice :)

It'll be transformed alright! Into a 1LE without the e-dif when I get done with it. May also look at H/C/I just to have more power than every other SS out there.

dealer sticker and some exterior pieces incoming :)

LOTS of mods planned already, haha.

Can you actually do the software tune for the shocks? That's something that would probably take a pretty willing dealer to fiddle with... Wheels aren't necessary, especially with the aftermarket ;) $2200 isn't TOO bad for all of those brake components, all told.

Any way to add the e-diff while you're at it?

Haha, yeah I have the mod glasses on since the platform has a lot of potential baked into it by GM.

Well, the beauty of the 1LE upgrade is that it'll be offered by GM! So all I would have to do is buy the kit from the internet and drop it off with the car at the dealership who can then download the tune to my shocks through the GM system. Would only take a couple hours altogether and my warranty would remain intact. Same suspension used on the Nurburbring record setting ZL1.

Nah, $2200 is a drop in the bucket compared to a BBK from Brembo in the aftermarket. Instead, I get Brembo six pistons for GM prices.

Not sure...it would require new half shafts, mounting hardware and software/potential module and harness changes. Lots of unknowns on that one right now...may make more sense to do a trade-in on a 1LE or ZL1 than to attempt it. I'm sure within a year, we'll know for sure.

Speaking of ZL1...they're starting to hit dealer lots and I'm already wondering if that's the better move to make in a year or two. (I'm ridiculous).:lol::lol:

Here's a page to keep eyes on:
http://www.chevrolet.com/performance...arts/2016.html

Wasn't this car supposed to save you money? :)

In that case, get the 1LE suspension ASAP, haha. Have you ridden in a 1LE car?

I'd bet on the ZL1 getting marked up like crazy, like the GT350. :(

LOL - you're right. I get carried away

I have not, but the FE3 mag ride (what comes on the SS), even in Track mode, feels pretty soft compared to say the 911 suspension. It's an odd suspension feel...soft but flat. So I am not too worried about the FE4 (what's on the 1LE) being too stiff.

I'll definitely have to test drive a 1LE just to be sure of course.

They could be, but so far it appears that they're not. My Chevy dealer has one coming onto the lot marked at sticker. They usually will discount off of sticker there....it'll be interesting to see if it commands any mark ups. The GT 350 markup is pretty stupid, IMO. It's a Ford, not a Ferrari. :roll:

This Chevy dealer also had a 2016 Vette that stickered at $69k going for $55k. (talk about a steal).

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...t-cars-feature

10Best for 2016 and now 2017 thanks to the 1LE

Love the AMG comparison...

Yeah, I'd be in a GT350 if they weren't all marked up to the moon. Maybe move into one in a few years...

GM is really on their game recently, but they've always been kind of a "giant slayer" with performance cars so it's no real surprise.

The numbers on the 1LE and the GT350 are pretty close too. Amazing how far these cars have come with this latest generation. The biggest thing for me was always how they turned and the interior quality. I hated all the cheap plastic that American cars used in their interiors over the years. Luckily, they've fixed that for the price points they're in by and large.

Check out the new ZL1. It's pretty much perfect, haha.

First modification coming and it's pretty much useless:

BMR strut tower brace.

Why?

$101 shipped.

GM puts these on the convertibles but by all accounts, it's not needed on the coupes.

So for $101 shipped I'll add it and see.

I'll probably end up taking it off and replacing it with the GM part when I do the 1LE upgrade.

Excellent, first 1LE kit info is out:

http://www.thatgmpartsguy.com/perfor...45?parent=1023

Now we just wait

lol strut brace. not needed on pretty much any car now

:lol::lol::lol: I know

I'm surprised that GM even developed one, lol. Ford makes one too and the RS even has one from the factory even though the towers are nearly on the firewall...

I guess every last bit of stiffness helps the suspension do what they want it to.

GM provides one for the convertible. There's a great matrix showing all the different braces each model gets. Will post later.

For the coupe, it speaks volumes when even the 1LE/ZL1 don't come with the strut brace. For what it's worth, there already are bars connecting the rear of each tower to the firewall. It's a stiff chassis in coupe form. :)

I'll probably get the GM one later after I do the 1LE suspension just for ****s and giggles. Parts are so cheap now!

Here are the brace matrices to show what model gets what from GM. Pretty cool of them to provide this information to us.

https://c7.staticflickr.com/6/5699/3...5552f126_z.jpg

https://c5.staticflickr.com/6/5761/3...6560369a_z.jpg

Awfully nice of them to document all of those bits and pieces.

Been to a race track lately?

That whole thing was a funny meme a while back... but yeah, the new Camaros are mighty impressive. That Z28 at Shenandoah was FAST!!!

I honestly wonder if 1LE/Coupe guys will add the X and Y braces to their cars - Like a lot of E36 coupe owners did (from the E36 verts) back in the day

I had a very hard time with the Mustang GT with Performance Pack that was there. The 911 could gain in the tight turns, but otherwise it was nearly impossible to keep him off of my bumper. Since the SS is even faster, it's safe to say that the 911 would have been lagging.

Great question, I'm wondering the same thing. How many of these are effective on a coupe, how many are simply adding weight?

Mustang and SS have a LOT more power and aren't really losing a whole lot in the corners. Modern muscle cars are impressive... I keep saying it, lol

Probably into the point of diminishing returns. Modern cars are so much stiffer than an E36 or even E46... and maybe even the E92 lol

it hurt the 911 ego a little bit, haha...but realistically, it's 10 years newer and has the benefit of modern tech and suspension design (even if the PP shocks are horrible).


:lol: very true! will be interesting to see what comes on the Z28...if it's without the braces like the 1LE and ZL1 are, then that tells you all you need to know about their effectiveness on the coupe.

Are the PP shocks really that bad? I've never even sat in a Mustang... maybe I should test drive one this weekend, lol

Do it :)