Is there anything faster? [Archive] - TriStateTuners.com

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Fourbanger

12-02-2005, 04:42 PM

Than american muscle???

I love the look on peoples faces when the realize my loud, obnoxious, big-winged car is in fact a dodge. Makes my day. :mrgreen:

I just wanted to also say that this site is picking back up, hopefully it stays that way.

snakeeyes

12-02-2005, 05:22 PM

srt4 dont sound like a muscle car
more like a snow blower

xEJ20x

12-02-2005, 06:05 PM

srt4 dont sound like a muscle car
more like a snow blower

Oh don't get so butt hurt cause not everyone wants a V8 :roll:

slavetothemuzic

12-02-2005, 06:25 PM

Is there anything better than american muscle???
Yes, there is. It's called a Skyline. http://www.aaroncarr.com/images/smileys/fawk.gif

The most disturbing Skyline I've ever heard of is over 1200 bhp and did over 200 mph through Tokyo.

Amazing, when you consider that it's still a street car. :eek:

S4toSTI

12-02-2005, 06:38 PM

Is there anything better then american muscle... sure it is called german and italian super cars. A 18.2 liter v8 making 400 doesn't impress me but a 5.0 v10 making 507 does.

1988 Olds

12-02-2005, 07:17 PM

What 18.2 V8 do you know off. Viper is a V-10 and makes 505hp and will smoke a M5

htheduck

12-02-2005, 07:25 PM

srt4 dont sound like a muscle car
more like a snow blower
Electric snow blower. :mrgreen:

SRT42EnVy

12-02-2005, 07:46 PM

Electric snow blower. :mrgreen:
Sounds good though, lol.

WhiteXFire

12-02-2005, 07:49 PM

What 18.2 V8 do you know off. Viper is a V-10 and makes 505hp and will smoke a M5
It was an exaggeration...the new viper is 8.3L V10 510hp, new vette 7.0L V8 505hp, whereas a 5.7L V10 porsche carrera GT puts down 605hp, 4.3L V8 ferrari puts down 490hp, etc. Much smaller displacement with as much or more power.

slavetothemuzic

12-02-2005, 07:51 PM

Viper is a V-10 and makes 505hp and will smoke a M5
I've never seen or even heard of a race between an M5 and a Viper, but the M5 does have a 600 Lb weight disadvantage.

The trans could be a factor as well, since the Viper has a manual trans and the M5 has a 7-spd auto-shift manual w/OD.

Still, with that said, if someone gave me the option of those two vehicles, I'd take the M5 without a doubt. They've engineered some unreal features into that car.

Check out the differences in the specs.

BMW M5 (http://research.cars.com/go/crp/features.jsp;jsessionid=KNCUJO4MVEMAVLAZGJXJXKY?de stURL=features.jsp&year=2006&makeid=5&modelid=48&myid=7970&superTrim=&acode=USB60BMC171A0&logtype=7&aff=forbesautos)

Dodge Viper (http://www.automotive.com/2005/12/dodge/viper/specifications/)

S4toSTI

12-02-2005, 07:56 PM

What 18.2 V8 do you know off. Viper is a V-10 and makes 505hp and will smoke a M5
I was kidding about the 18.2 and the viper is what displacement v10 8.3 right and the m5 is a 5 liter v10 and the m5 is making two more hp. oh and what is the redline on a viper 6k oh and the redline on a m5 is what 8250. I don't disagree that the viper is a fast car but the m5 has a higher top speed and has 7 gears... and a more effcient engine, and i don't think you can argue any of that

BradC

12-02-2005, 08:02 PM

I was kidding about the 18.2 and the viper is what displacement v10 8.3 right and the m5 is a 5 liter v10 and the m5 is making two more hp. oh and what is the redline on a viper 6k oh and the redline on a m5 is what 8250. I don't disagree that the viper is a fast car but the m5 has a higher top speed and has 7 gears... and a more effcient engine, and i don't think you can argue any of that
Higher redline does not equal faster car...

S4toSTI

12-02-2005, 08:22 PM

Higher redline does not equal faster car...
I do think you missed the point but ok i will give you that a higher redline does not equal a faster car... tho read the rest of my post and comment on that if you would like. Tho i think you would ten to agree that two engines making the same power and have the same ammount of cylinders and one happens to be 3 liters and change less which do you think is the better engine.

poolmike

12-03-2005, 12:25 AM

Its like this

Viper: 1)Release clutch, if it doesnt fall apart you get 2)tire smoke and.............more tire smoke and then you get 3) ....still smokin and it only moved a few feet.

BMW: 1)stand on the gas 2)release clutch 3) chirp tires and launch

American muscle is fun, but engineering gets the power where it belongs.

S4toSTI

12-03-2005, 02:45 AM

Well with smg you have no clutch and someone said it is auto it is not a auto at all it is a manual with no clutch pedal. Either way yeah american muscle big engines are cool yet i think we can all agree they are not highly tuned machines.

silver05bullet

12-03-2005, 05:08 AM

Theres alot of cars faster then muscle cars (an Srt-4 is not a muscle car) but most of the crazy sick cars use american engines in them

The only thing is they are just big ass V-8's prducing horsepower when my puny 2.0 Turbo can make as much power as alot of these 4.6, 5.0 or bigger engines, therefore the 2.0 engine is way more efficient the liter to horsepower ratio is way bigger

also think that with todays gasoline prices we are seein more efficient smaller engines producing as much if not more power as the big old school boys

Nonetheless Muscle cars are the bagn diggity bang

D Money

12-03-2005, 05:10 AM

srt4 dont sound like a muscle car
more like a snow blower
Personally I think srt-4's sound good. Maybe you are just used to the detroit iron, the original ford rustang sound. Let me guess your exhaust mods: hmmmm.....headers, off road x-pipe, and bassani cat-back lol..awesome. Cobra's are sick, dont get me wrong, but the ones that are sick came out in 03.

1988 Olds

12-05-2005, 12:35 AM

Yeah guys I can't argue that American cars are anywhere near as nice as anything not made in America but nothing beats the sound of a Cobra or any other 5.0, 5.7 V8.

DropTopChevy

12-05-2005, 12:48 AM

Both sides are wrong. German engineering wins hands down. :banana: :wiggle: (insert cabbage patch here). Oh yeah!

300zTT

12-05-2005, 08:59 AM

my Z!

2point4DSM

12-05-2005, 09:24 AM

The reason European cars have smaller motors is because they were designed to run the autobahn. Having a smaller motor with as much hp actually saves gas. Yeah, I realize the new z06 is boasting that it actually sips gas compared to other cars with similar sized motors but I'd like to see how it actually does in the real world. I've got a feeling the numbers are hyped a bit.

And personally, I like the whine of a turbo, especially a big turbo, and to a lesser extent a supercharger over the sound of a V8. That V8 rumble doesn't do anything for me anymore.

Stand next to a hemi powered top fuel dragster if you want to appreciate the noise coming out of a big, sic, motor, lol.

D Money

12-05-2005, 06:31 PM

my Z!
Sorry the Z is not that fast. Especially on the street! You cant even beat an evo with tbe exhaust and a flash lol. We already seen that!

300zTT

12-05-2005, 08:28 PM

Sorry the Z is not that fast. Especially on the street! You cant even beat an evo with tbe exhaust and a flash lol. We already seen that!
**** u talking about son i beat tony and swavy. and if u remember i beat tony for a dead stop. and tonys car is sposse to be fater then swavays!!!

TROLL

12-05-2005, 08:30 PM

subwrxkid and 300zxTT-- you need to learn to stay on topic. please make an effort because i see you doing this in a lot of threads... pick up the phone or something please.
bryan

D Money

12-05-2005, 08:36 PM

subwrxkid and 300zxTT-- you need to learn to stay on topic. please make an effort because i see you doing this in a lot of threads... pick up the phone or something please.
bryan
Yup yup. My bad.

HickRocket1258

12-05-2005, 09:48 PM

I would have to say that I am for only american muscle only really. Some of the import things can impress me but not a lot. I don't like the sound of an SRT-4 because it sounds like a MAC truck to me. I just love the sound of american muscle because I've been around that since a little guy haha. I will have respect though for the import guys. You can't compare a turbo 4 cyliner and a n/a v8 though, just completely two different vehicles. Just saying that because I don't feel like hearing the comparison of the two.

ITSTOCK

12-06-2005, 05:46 PM

**** u talking about son i beat tony and swavy. and if u remember i beat tony for a dead stop. and tonys car is sposse to be fater then swavays!!!

wow, your car is so fast, will you be my hero? :thumbup: :roll:

D Money

12-06-2005, 05:48 PM

wow, your car is so fast, will you be my hero? :thumbup: :roll:
Lol totally agree here!

snakeeyes

12-06-2005, 07:45 PM

D Money

12-06-2005, 07:46 PM

acidbyte7

12-06-2005, 08:00 PM

subwrxkid i dont think ive ever seen someone post as often as you do per day and say absoluetly nothing. Your posts are almost always meaningless except as inside jokes or one liners back and forth to your neighborhood butt buddies

Your posts are an eyesore. 99% of them are trivial comments that could have been sent via IM.

bro i think you should chill out...who cares if subwrxkid posts stupid crap....don't look at it and don't be bothered by it...and who are you calling butt buddies? i'm just wondering...you guys are pretty tough behind a screen and keyboard...

acidbyte7

12-06-2005, 08:04 PM

srt4 dont sound like a muscle car
more like a snow blower

what about that one tough guy? i think thats an eye sore...was it a joke too i don't know...

teh DIRT

12-06-2005, 09:05 PM

get back on topic. :furious:

DropTopChevy

12-07-2005, 02:06 AM

Ok ok ok nothing is faster than pete's car^ and i mean nothing its a beast. Slow race of death forever. :rotfl:

300zTT

12-07-2005, 02:52 AM

wow, your car is so fast, will you be my hero? :thumbup: :roll:
thanx @ss!

2point4DSM

12-07-2005, 09:19 AM

Guys, let's get back on-topic. Snakeeyes has been warned and if he disrespects another member again will be banned. So let's end it here.

1988 Olds

12-07-2005, 11:38 AM

ITSTOCK, I'll be your hero.

SilverTurboRidin

12-07-2005, 11:47 AM

Okay on topic... Your Z, Evo, And 300ZX ARE ALL IN THE WRONG SECTION...this is domestic not import... :P

And for the money you pay for the SRT-4 or even a Cobalt SS its unbeatable

2point4DSM

12-07-2005, 12:02 PM

And for the money you pay for the SRT-4 or even a Cobalt SS its unbeatable

They have their place just like the mustangs and vettes. For all out straight line performance I'm going with a mustang or vette. And for a fast daily driver I'd go with the SRT-4 or Cobalt.

But then again I'd still like the ability to drive the car year round and or not have to heat up the rubber just to get decent launches. The reason I liked the typhoon/cyclones best.

Although from what I understand the awd turbo domestics aren't all that fast. Too bad.

If I ever go with a track only, fast down the 1/4, type of toy I'm going with a Mustang for several reasons. $$$ is the biggest reason, lol. Last year I had the choice of several sub 10 sec mustangs (1 ran 8s) all for around $10-16k. Hard to beat those numbers!

Fourbanger

12-07-2005, 12:13 PM

DAMmmmmmmmmmmmit every time i try to post the program stops responding.

Oh well short and sweet.

The europeans are making big power with lil displacement for big bucks. Once again ill reiterate justins (silvers) point that bang for buck=domestics.
They can charge 300k for a ferrari with 500 hp? And then gm only charges what? 70k for a vette? 80k for a viper? Ill do the ricer thing and say that ill take the 80k viper and put the other 200k (lmfao it would only take about 100k) into the car and then it would eat ferraris (stock of course) for appetizers.

And yeah my car is a muscle car, unless you wanna call it a tuner? Snakey boy? Are you having problems with your pony? Im sure its broken in one way or another so you have to knock everyone else. Yeah so what subie post whores, is that a crime? Hes got the balls to speak his mind on any topic unlike you.
Your rustang is inferior to my srt-4 without forced induction or a hell of a alot of engine work. Yet its a snowblower? Then whats that make your pony? A bigger snow blower? with striaght pipes!!!!i! Teh cool lemme tell you..

Oh yeah snake hows your muffler?? Yeah??? How much do you have into that heapo-poop? And you run what? 12's hahahahhahahahhahhahahahahahhahahahahhahhahahha enjoy your 10 mpg when your not beating it and oh yeah lemme know when you discover the whole idea of thinking before you speak.

I like to think that my car is a muscle car, it sounds kinda mean.

And to the evo owner that mention the hp/l ratio please dont talk anymore thats the dumbest logic ever! Omg that is disturbing.

How about this, ready?
Put a turbo/supercharger on a viper and see who would win a race a ferrarri or a viper. And the viper would win if the drive wasnt a douche bag with a lead foot. And it would still cost half as much as the ferrari.
And when i say race i mean any race except maybe auto-x only b/c ive heard the vipers have a crappier turning radius than the srt-4's.

I have to pee. So im done for now.

maggot

12-07-2005, 12:49 PM

my (almost stock) srt-4> every other car

TROLL

12-07-2005, 01:19 PM

DropTopChevy

12-07-2005, 01:47 PM

yo guys, a little heated debate is a good thing, but DONT make this personal. of course everyone loves their cars, hopefully there's roomin your heart to love others too (or at least respect them). this debate will be going on until we're flying spaceships and whatnot, so just enjoy it for what it is, continue to debate and make good points, and stay away from making it personal.
carry on...
I love my camaro even though its slow as poo, but back on topic I dont see the point of arguing over cars? Have fun :thumbup:
OT: my spaceship is on back order J/K
< :screwy:

Prototype240

12-07-2005, 01:54 PM

TROLL

12-07-2005, 02:10 PM

In the end, it's all just a big man-unit waving contest. Who cares? There's always someone faster, or with a more expensive or more well rounded car. Unless you own a veyron 16-4...then you're just a cut above everyone else. ;)

:iagree:

Fourbanger

12-07-2005, 02:31 PM

Isn't it silly to have this debate? They're all whole worlds of cars, it's like comparing apples to oranges to trash cans to vibrators. SRT-4's are cheap performance vehicles. Yup, I said it. CHEAP. They get grouped right well there with a bunch of other such oriented cars. American muscle is raw torque, unrefined, and shoddy. Yup, I went there, too. That's why American sports cars are so inexpensive compared to their international counterparts. <Insert Foreign Sports Sedan/coupe here> makes intelligent use of what technology is available. Technology is expensive, hence the larger price tag.

In the end, it's all just a big man-unit waving contest. Who cares? There's always someone faster, or with a more expensive or more well rounded car. Unless you own a veyron 16-4...then you're just a cut above everyone else. ;)
Well its not really silly to debate. Fight over yes, but not if we can keep it clean and informative.

Granted technology costs money but id have to argue that a lot of the production cost associated with european cars goes into their "handmade" interiors. You get what you pay for, its as simple as that. No matter which way you cut it.

Now then, to say that the srt-4 is cheap may be an overstatement. Its cheap for what you get, yes but its not cheap. Imo cheap would be ummm free or something close to it. The srt is a cheap performance vehicle now that is the best statement ive heard all day. And? Whats the point? Its cheap, then again so are used mustangs and nissans.
My whole grip about that statement is that cheap is a strong word. Kinda like hate. Now i agree my car isnt expensive in anyway.... umm thats why i bought it. But its not cheaply made.

As for tourqe and domestics. Yeah once again that can be taken two different ways. The tourque is what allows the domestics to pull through gears rapidly, and do it with 4000+ lbs of steel. I dont understand how your using the word "shody" in your statement either. But to say that the corvette is unrefined is just plain retarded. Ive never seen so many bells and whistles in a car, well a new caddy has more but thats beyond the point. Its not unrefined by anymeans.
Its all really subject to preference. Hell some people look at what were doing (souping up cars) as a joke. To be honest everybody that i talk to about their car history/experiences has said that they regret dumping absurd $$$$'s into them. Just food for thought.

Prototype240

12-07-2005, 06:02 PM

Yes, the corvette is unrefined. The vette/viper/cobra all have a lot of punch, but in comparison to the higher end vehicles coming out of Europe, they just don't hold water. Compare it to a BMW 6 or higher series, a Bentley, Ferrari. You can't equate them. I know you're going to say, "Yeah, but the Bentley cost $XXX,XXX more than the Vette." Whatever, dude. The Continental GT is still a more refined car. And the refinement extends beyond the interior. Your reference to that is pretty naive. Have you ever examined a foreign car's engine? You know, one that cost more than $30,000? You'd have to be 'retarded' to call them unrefined and lacking in technological advance.

And don't feel all ass-hurt because I called your car cheap. I've driven plenty of cheap cars. I recognize them as such. And you should, too. Just because your car has a turbo doesn't mean its god's gift to car-dom.

Modding cars (Souping up? What kind? Minestrone?) is where the knowledgeable get to laugh at the rich. We put half the money in and get twice the performance. But where does the rest of that money mysteriously come from? Hey, you guessed it, your time spent researching and learning it all. It's a toss up one way or another. It costs you either way. I find modding cars to be a great hobby. It's fun. You have to go into it knowing things can go wrong, or like your friends, you'll regret it. Personally, I can't wait to have a heavily modded FD sitting in my garage when I retire.

SRT42EnVy

12-08-2005, 05:14 PM

Well its not really silly to debate. Fight over yes, but not if we can keep it clean and informative.

Granted technology costs money but id have to argue that a lot of the production cost associated with european cars goes into their "handmade" interiors. You get what you pay for, its as simple as that. No matter which way you cut it.

Now then, to say that the srt-4 is cheap may be an overstatement. Its cheap for what you get, yes but its not cheap. Imo cheap would be ummm free or something close to it. The srt is a cheap performance vehicle now that is the best statement ive heard all day. And? Whats the point? Its cheap, then again so are used mustangs and nissans.
My whole grip about that statement is that cheap is a strong word. Kinda like hate. Now i agree my car isnt expensive in anyway.... umm thats why i bought it. But its not cheaply made.

As for tourqe and domestics. Yeah once again that can be taken two different ways. The tourque is what allows the domestics to pull through gears rapidly, and do it with 4000+ lbs of steel. I dont understand how your using the word "shody" in your statement either. But to say that the corvette is unrefined is just plain retarded. Ive never seen so many bells and whistles in a car, well a new caddy has more but thats beyond the point. Its not unrefined by anymeans.
Its all really subject to preference. Hell some people look at what were doing (souping up cars) as a joke. To be honest everybody that i talk to about their car history/experiences has said that they regret dumping absurd $$$$'s into them. Just food for thought.
:mrgreen: I agree, and I dont think $ can determine how refined a car is or how technologically advanced it is, we all buy cars for different reasons, usually when were young we buy "cheap" cars to compensate for not having an expensive car and we make our "cheap" cars expensive by dumping $$ into it until one day when were older and have enough money to buy an expensive quality car that comes with everything. Speed, luxury, comfort, durability, technology, and appearance, we will all look back at our "cheap" cars that only had speed or luxury or one of the desires we wanted in a car, and we added some things to it to make it more appealing, and to satisfy our passion of modifying a car. You dont see Lamborghinis, Farraris, Bentleys being modified and thats because... honestly they dont need to be and thats the reason why we buy "cheap" cars and thats the difference between Countries and there manufacturing of cars, America makes performance and thats pretty much the aspect they look at, thats why theres 90,000$ cars that can compete with 500,000$ cars, but other countries want more then just Power and speed, they want there cars to be classy and the price tag alone of the car says it all when your driving down the street and people are looking or your sitting in your leather heated seats doing 160 on the Autobahn.

silver05bullet

12-08-2005, 05:20 PM

**** u talking about son i beat tony and swavy. and if u remember i beat tony for a dead stop. and tonys car is sposse to be fater then swavays!!!
U still on that i beat him, man u didnt even have a chance could u even see my license plate son whats good party in my pants

SRT42EnVy

12-08-2005, 05:22 PM

:rotfl: U still on that i beat him, man u didnt even have a chance could u even see my license plate son whats good party in my pants
what are u talking about? read my post and stay on topic we were in a large debate about cars and the reason why we do what we do and u come out of nowhere with this post, lmao... I wanna see what u think about this read the last 5 or 6 posts.

silver05bullet

12-08-2005, 05:47 PM

Like it was previously stated and SRT-4, even an EVO and an STI are relatively cheap cars, sure theyre fast and yes they do have alot of engineering put into them to make them such for the price tag, they are like exotic cars built with a budget, therefore a lot of sacrifice had to been put into the car the cars will not ride as smooth as a AMG Mercedes Benz or a M5 or a Ferrari or Lamborghini sure they are almost as fast as some of these cars stock, but with the more refined and at the same time expensive cars you get the power plus some other qualities like LUXURY for once, they are also a status quo type a vehicle like no joe shmo will go out and buy a 100k$+ vehicle and drive it around, when you see someone in one of these extremely expensive cars well you know they are rolling in dough or they wouldnt be driving them.

At the same time we can do things to sort of catch up to those cars whether it be putting navigation, nice comfortable seats, better quality interiors, nicer wheels, intakes, exhausts and other performance goodies, we might be faster then them, we might outhandle them, we might even have higher quality in out interiors but guess what when someone who doesnt know jack about our cars they will still just say oh look at that hooked up neon, or that hooked up lancer.

In the end us modifying our cars is very very very pointless in the end its still a lancer or a neon. And sorry Bradley an SRT-4 is not american muscle, and an EVO is not a high performance sports car, they do resemble high performance, but for performance u have to pay. Thats why both u and me got exhausts to push a lil more out of our engines and such.

Anyways im done in closing you get what u pay for and if it is strictly speed go for a neon or a lancer if you want the other finer things in life then you know you going to pay for them, in the end they are both cars and they are good for what they are :cyberguy: type too much

Fourbanger

12-08-2005, 06:10 PM

Dammit i had a good response this site hates lots of typing and being previewed.

I never got butthurt b/c you said the srt is cheap dont worry man im not touchy like that.

And to say that the vette is unrefined is more your opinion than fact. I couldnt find numbers at work b/c i was blocked from translating a few sites from german but... i did find the good ole 2003 viper to help me prove my point that b/c its european doesnt mean it owns.

The comparison:
Viper srt-10 03' vs. Ferrari 360 Modena 99'

Lap times around nurnburg= 8:13 vs. 8:09 respectively
4 seconds off? From a ferrari? Unrefined? No. Not on the same level true. But they are closing fast.

There is a whole bunch of good comparisons that show their performance.
Linky (http://www.track-challenge.com/main_e.asp)

The only reason i used the nurburg as a reference is b/c its pretty much what every car is measured by. Im not gonna compare the beemers b/c thats not fair they are tuned specifically for that track. The m3 csl would **** on a vette at teh nurnburg but would inturn be **** on in a straight line. Once again the two countries have different demands.

This is my favorite comparison.
Viper is on the left and modena on the right..... see that difference once you get up in mph/kph??? Thats that unrefined tourqe you were bashing. :finga:

Acceleration
0 - 40 Km/h 1,7 s 1,7 s
0 - 60 Km/h 2,5 s 2,5 s
0 - 80 Km/h 3,4 s 3,6 s
0 - 100 Km/h 4,5 s 4,7 s
0 - 120 Km/h 5,8 s 6,4 s
0 - 140 Km/h 7,8 s 8,2 s
0 - 160 Km/h 9,4 s 10,5 s
0 - 180 Km/h 11,4 s 13,1 s
0 - 200 Km/h 14 s 16,1 s
Top Speed 306 Km/h 295 Km/h
:thumbup:
Lets keep this discussion going id like to see some numbers of a vette on the nurnburg.

Brian.

Prototype240

12-08-2005, 08:18 PM

05OCsrt-4

12-09-2005, 12:06 AM

Electric snow blower. :mrgreen:

mine sounds like a diesel truck though, and when did 4 cylinders become american muscle?? american muscle is mostly motor possibly a supercharger

Fourbanger

12-09-2005, 11:58 AM

Good info...I'd like to see some corvette numbers on neurburgring myself. But you're missing the definition of 'refined.' Yes, they put down similar accel/top speed numbers.

But look at the power output vs. displacement and then look at those times again. The Ferrarri is faster with a two cylinder, 100PS, and 5000! cc disadvantage, and only it's only 100kg lighter than the Viper. That's the refinement I speak of. Any joe-schmoe can throw a huge displacement v-10 or v-12 in a chassis and make ridiculous power and have half decent lap times. But to do it with a V8, less than half the displacement, and still come out on top....that's classy.
True, to refine is to become pure or perfected. The europeans like i said have refined their vehicles, and the american muscle is in the process of being refined. I was just impressed a viper was only 4 seconds behind the modena. Granted he probably made up all the time on the long straights. :rotfl: There are many different paths to the one common goal which is the "perfect sports car" I like the thought of a viper accelerating so quickly that it almost hurts.

And im not really serious when i say my TURBO'd neon is a muscle car im kinda saying that in jest.

I dont disagree that the europeans have refined their vehicles more, not at all. :thumbup: Americans have just found a cheaper way to achieve comprarable performance numbers.

slavetothemuzic

12-09-2005, 12:17 PM

The europeans like i said have refined their vehicles, and the american muscle is in the process of being refined.
I disagree with that. American cars (all cars for that matter) are evolving, but I don't see American muscle cars becoming more refined.

That's just not their market. You're talking about two totally different approaches.

One is to build luxurious sports cars, with all the bells and whistles, make them in limited numbers, and sell them at a premium price to a limited audience.

The other is to build something with as much bang for the buck as you can cram into it, while keeping the cost low enough for the average consumer to be able to afford one, then build an assload of them.

Fourbanger

12-09-2005, 02:16 PM

I disagree with that. American cars (all cars for that matter) are evolving, but I don't see American muscle cars becoming more refined.

That's just not their market. You're talking about two totally different approaches.

One is to build luxurious sports cars, with all the bells and whistles, make them in limited numbers, and sell them at a premium price to a limited audience.

The other is to build something with as much bang for the buck as you can cram into it, while keeping the cost low enough for the average consumer to be able to afford one, then build an assload of them.

And that is why i love american muscle.

slavetothemuzic

12-09-2005, 03:02 PM

And that is why i love american muscle.
That's what this site is all about. To each their own.

I have two issues with American muscle. One is that it has an extremely low uniqueness factor, becuase it's been done to death, over and over for years and years.

The other issue I have is that it seems as though a large number of the owners are closed minded dickheads that think their vehicle is gods gift to motorsports and that nothing else compares, and have a severe attitude towards any kind of import, but most especially Japanese imports. On the opposite side of that coin, of the people I know who drive imports, most of them at least respect American cars and what they are capable of, even though that may not be their particular taste or preference.

Both of those are enough to keep me away from American cars for the forseeable future, but I do have respect for nice American muscle cars, and am still impressed by some of them.

MPowerKai

12-10-2005, 02:50 AM

Fourbanger

12-10-2005, 08:54 AM

^^ Thats true, I spanked this guys 2003 mustang GT in my S2000 and he started flippin me off at the next stop light, wtf??

Bugatti Veyron 1001 hp stock with a stop speed of OVER 260! Thats right the top speed has not been reached!!
The top speed has not been reached because they cars front end started to lift up after 250+
I was just reading about that!!!
W-16 - 16 cyl. engine with 4 turbos pushing at least 981hp all four wheels

weighing in over 4200 lbs
Claimed performance:
0-62- 2.5 sec.
0-124- 7.3
You have to put an extra key in the car in order to reach "HIGH SPEED" mode.

Gordon Murray designed it along with the bt43 i think thats the number which is the fan car that f1 banned after one race.
He also designed the infamous mclaren f1 which has now been de-throned as the fastest production car.

Price tag- $1.2 million

Fourbanger

12-10-2005, 08:59 AM

My new dream car:
http://patrick-obe.chez.tiscali.fr/original/bugati1.gif

Fourbanger

12-10-2005, 09:02 AM

http://www.yellow-llama.com/downloads/bugatti1.jpg

beastiality

Fourbanger

12-10-2005, 09:15 AM

All created well at least designed by a...... south african who's only schooling was at an art school were he learned how to desing cars no degree.

Prototype240

12-10-2005, 03:16 PM

Hahaha...now that's a 180 if I've ever seen one! Veyron's been my "Unachievable dream car" for a while now.

Per supercars.net:

engine Quad Turbo W16
valvetrain DOHC 4 Valves / Cyl w/VVT
displacement 7993 cc / 487.8 cu in
bore 86 mm / 3.39 in
stroke 86 mm / 3.39 in
compression 9.0:1
power 646.5 kw / 987 bhp @ 6000 rpm
hp per litre 125.25 bhp per litre
bhp/weight
torque 1250 nm / 922.0 ft lbs@ 2200-5500 rpm
drive wheels Mid Engine / 4WD
front wheels F 52 x 23.5 cm / 20.5 x 9.3 in
rear wheels R 54 x 32.5 cm / 21.3 x 12.8 in
front tire size PAX 245/690R520
rear tire size PAX335/710R540
weight 1888 kg / 4162 lbs
transmission 7-Speed DSG
top speed 407.2 kph / 253 mph
0 - 60 mph 2.5 seconds

licensedtothrill

12-11-2005, 09:01 AM

Raven18940

12-11-2005, 09:15 AM

How did we fall so far behind the rest of the world in engines and technology?
Pushrods and 2 valves per cylinder. ;)

OptiCon

12-20-2005, 09:51 AM

Just a cool bit of info sparked by something i read in this thread...

hp per litre 125.25 bhp per litre
Shelby/Lotus/Dodge's TIII came from factory with 102hp per liter back in the early 90's. And the current hp record for the same motor is 227whp PER LITER (the guy lives in Quakertown too).

A 5.0 mustang needs to be over 1000whp before it has the same ratio. Craaaazy.

And now, back to your regularly scheduled thread...

OptiCon

12-20-2005, 10:05 AM

Got to love muscle cars but; if Chevy could pull the hp per liter that Hondas formula 1 Car does a standard 302 motor would be pushing something around 3200hp.

How did we fall so far behind the rest of the world in engines and technology?
Chevy doesn't make a Formula 1 car. And Formula 1 technology is FAR too complex and expensive to make available to consumers in economy cars. That’s why euro crap costs as much as a damn house.

In the money-heavy world of racing, anything goes. But in a consumer market there is such a thing as over engineering. Americans like things simple. We either like to work on and modify our own cars or drive a cheap appliance until it bites the dust... Not pay a specialized service tech $130 for an oil change.

My dream car is a Nissan Pulsar GTiR. 2200lbs, AWD, 2.0 turbo with potential. Screw the Bugatti. Copious amount of money don't impress me near as much as a 400whp economy car.

2point4DSM

12-20-2005, 02:00 PM

Got to love muscle cars but; if Chevy could pull the hp per liter that Hondas formula 1 Car does a standard 302 motor would be pushing something around 3200hp.

How did we fall so far behind the rest of the world in engines and technology?

Who said we were ever ahead. Mercedes invented the modern motor, Bosh invented the injectors, and we have been copying from those guys the whole time since. I know mitsu has the patent for balance shafts.

Btw, it was interesting to see on the discovery channel (?) that our rocket technology and NASA was actually started by German scientist that use to work for Hitler. After the defeat of the Nazis America took half and the Russians took the other half of the scientist and technology.

max2k1

12-20-2005, 03:17 PM

Sorry this is late, but I hate the Bugatti. Ill take a Saleen S7 twin turbo over that car any day

Broken5hift

12-20-2005, 03:23 PM

porsche GT3? anyone?

slavetothemuzic

12-20-2005, 06:29 PM

Btw, it was interesting to see on the discovery channel (?) that our rocket technology and NASA was actually started by German scientist that use to work for Hitler. After the defeat of the Nazis America took half and the Russians took the other half of the scientist and technology.
Very true. We grabbed a whole bunch of Nazi scientists at the end of WWII.

In the words of Richard Jeni "We might not think of an idea first, but we'll figure out a way to f**k it up and sell more of it." :lol:

OWENthatsmyname

12-21-2005, 01:14 PM

whats wrong with the bugatti veyron? i must admit it does look kinda ugly, but its Speed LIMITED to 253mph. it can go faster......... rediculous....... 4 turbo chargers, 10 radiators 16 CYLINDERS!

max2k1

12-22-2005, 03:27 AM

i think the saleen is a better car...with only a twin turbo v8 the saleen can get over 240mph while the veyron is has 16 cyliner quad turbo setup and going 253mph. I just feel that the Veyron is way too hyped up

2Mopars1Ford

12-24-2005, 09:37 AM

:cry: A thread four pages long about muscle cars, and none of the cars mentioned make me think of one.
I still think of muscle cars as the old school pre 74 cars.
Nothing beats the sound of one of those.
Heres a list of the members cars I grabbed off of one of the other forums I post on when I think of the term "muscle car"
---6 second Zone ---
6.69 @ 207 Allen Johnson, 2005 Dodge Stratus 500ci PS Hemi
6.49 1/4 4.45 1/8 1.03 60' 85 ss 526 blown alan johnson hemi gator(jerry Farmer va)
---7 second Zone ---
7.21 @ 193, 1.11 60', Hemifred, turbo Road Runner
7.41 @ 180.01, HMcCandless Jr, 540 indy, dragster.
7.68 @ 179.31, 1.08 60', 572stealth, '92 Dodge Daytona 572 B1MC, torqueflight, 2330#
7.91 @ 181, 1.27 60', valiant65, 65 Valiant, 3319#, twinturbo 353B1BA + lenco 5-speed
7.95 @ 168.56, 1.173 60' 408 cubes, Indy headed, fuel injected on alcohol,slingshot383

---8 second Zone ---
8.02 @ 174+, The Haze, twin turbo 452", Charger
8.13 @ 168, 1.165, 412ci all motor, glide, Dodge Omni
8.14 @ 169,with fogger and plate,Leon Hudson, 65 Barracuda
8.178 @ 167.12, 1.139 60', B1 Ken, '88 T-Bird, 2430#, 511 B-1 w/ Glide
8.180 @ 165, SG303, 91 Daytona, 2420# 572 single 4, glide, just motor
8.24 @ 163, 1.15 60', Rapid588, 93'Dodge Stealth, 2490#, motor only.
8.36 @ 164, JoeZ, 1972 Challenger, 451 B1 Nitrous, 727, 10.5" tire, 3005#
8.48 @ 160, sp6162, 80 Omni, 2170#, 500cu, Indy-1,/glide.
8.52 @ 156.4, 1.17 60',SB412DUSTER 72 Duster,5.33 @ 126-1/8, 4link B/half 2424# 412/W7 NO P/A
8.57 @ 161, W8Duster, '71 Duster, 430 W8, single stage fogger, 'Glide, 29x10.5 (non W), 3350#
8.62 @ 157, TwinDick Racing, 73 Duster, 528, B1, Nitrous, Turbo 400, 10.5w 3340#
8.68 @ 156, "Tazmaniac" 1971 Challenger, 500 B1, Powerglide, 2650#
8.77 @ 153.16, Gregsdart, 65 dart ,528cu 440-1, 3000#, 2780 den altitude. NA 6/26/04
8.78 @ 160.34mph Lenny Melton 1968 DART 3,540lbs 10.5 ET streets. This is areal street driven car.
8.78 @ 153.71 mph, Pittsburghracer, 91 daytona 499 rb 440-1 unported .690 roller 2400# with driver
8.781 @ 155.13, 1.261 60', Hemifred SOX&MARTIN DUSTER
8.908 @ 150.40, 1.245 60', RT540, 69 Coronet, 2840#, 540" B1BS-727TF
8.94 at 150, 1.25 60', B1duster, 498-1, 200 shot, 3000lb, 4.56, 14.5-32s

---9 second Zone ---
9.063 @ 146.23, Beeracuda, 74 Barracuda, 2800#, 499/PG
9.08 @ 149.75, Megadart, 422" W5 headed sb, all motor, #2540
9.096 @ 146.79,MoparRacer99,68 Charger,2900#,547"/pg
9.100 @ 149.51, NHRAMARK, 70 Duster, 3050 lbs, 540" Indy
9.11 @ 145,Bill_LBSR, 68 Dart 3400 lbs 499/PG
9.14 147mph, Renegade5047, 69 dart 470 cu in, P/G,2520 lbs.
9.19 @ 139.66, Bigcube '69 Dart , 2800#, all motor, Indy 557cid
9.27 @ 144.50, 572charger 3850#, pump gas, 10.5street tires /4 1/2 " exhaust w/tail pipes/ 125 hp shot on leaf springs/ driven daily / not a race car !
9.29 @ 143.8, 1.27 60', BEST MACHINE, 65 Coronet 3460# 511,B1BS,10.5W,3.5"X pipe w muffs, All Motor and Foot Brakin
9.33 @ 142, 1.23 60', 1BADLILCHARGER '81 Charger 2300#, 440/727w/brake, Eddys,
9.34 @ 144.97, TheOtherDodge,498, Auto, 3450 lbs, true 10.5 tires, through the mufflers
9.35 @ 144.66, Bad66, '66 Dart GT, 471 B1 stroker...,all throttle no bottle
9.43 @ 126, sloride, shutoff @ 1000', testing 70 cuda 572 indy head 3500# street trim w/225 shot, 9.99 @ 136 on motor
9.47 @ 142.5, MR P BODY, 395 ci W-2 2430#
9.582 @ 140.82 Eric, 81 Arrow 2354# tired 440 SR motor..:)
9.59 @ 142, Biginchmotor, 72 Barracuda, 3000#, 500 inch motor, 727 auto no trans brake, super stock springs, 4.30 gear
9.61 @ 140.55, HEMI71GTX... all throttle no bottle, 500ci, 4link, PG, 3075, 4.56's, 440-1's, Megablock, 3075 with me in it
9.682 @ 136.6, 1.330 60', 440Jim, '69 Dart GTS, 3150#, 471 CID, no roller cam here!
9.79 137.6mph,W8CUDA71, 415w8,3308lbs,leafsprings!
9.81 @ 137, acme383, 70 roadrunner, 493, jerico 4-speed, 3490#, 10.5 tire
9.82 @ 135.89, Mopargilley, 68 Barracuda, 400" W-2 motor 3170# stock 727 W/brake 4:56gear 11.5 tire
9.84 @ 134.90, Bumps440. 69GTX 3240#, all motor, 446ci, stageIV iron heads, Footbraker
9.85 @ 135 398-W2 Duster398
9.85 @ 132.2, DCI, 38 Simca 225ci Slant 6/904, 1/8 6.10 @ 109.8, 2315#, Turobcharged 12# of boost EFI on Methanol
9.91 @ 142 mph,440 906 heads, Mrsixpak
9.93 @ 132.97, moparjohn, 1970 GTX 3250 lbs car and driver at 700 air density Route 66 Joliet
9.94 @ 133.99, b3422w5, 70 duster, 422w5, 3380#, 727, leafs
9.96 @ 134, DavidDean, 71 Duster, 5500'DA 413" 904 SB 2850# 6.18 @ 109 1/8 3500'DA
9.952 @ 131.56, 1.350 60', Sleepyhead416 73 Duster W-5 416 904 Dana 4.88 Ladderbar 2880 lbs
9.96 @ 133.5, ProSport, 73' Dart sport, 451, E-heads, 727, 1.37 60 ft, 3035#, all motor
9.97 @ 133.88 340RICK 70 Challenger 416 W5's leafs and street tires all motor
9.97 @ 135.46 1.36 60ft 493 john, 493" pump gas,street driven, foot brakin and no nitrous
9.978 @134.24, 1.360 60'(1Bad440)70 Challenger streetcar,footbrake,leafs,Dot's 3460lb .060 440 stock stroke all motor

---10 second Zone ---
10.03 @ 135 through exhaust on dot tires paul swigart 69 pro street cuda
10.05 @ 133.59, 1.39 60', Duster John, 73 duster, 6.40 @ 107.90 1/8, street car pump gas, mufflers, 10.5"tires,#3400
10.088 @ 137.53, 1.556 60', Tig, '74 Challenger, 528ci, Indy -13 heads, 3892# W/D, N/A.
10.09 @131.97,Thumperdart,1.41 60 ft,72 dart 3200+, home port Eheads
10.09 @132,sixpakdodge, 1964 Dodge 330, 452, 2995 lbs.
10:14@129.70 70 Challenger 040 over 440 eddie heads .footbrake.
10.19 @ 129.63 1.395 60 ft, andradaracing 1970 dart. 3000 lbs w/o me. NO-Transbrake.
10.22 @ 132.37, 1.498 60', Clutch, 88 D100, 512ci NA
10.22 @ 131, 1.36 60ft, BigFish69, 440 Cuda
10.23 @ 130.50, 1.41 60', Marvo451 '71 Duster, 451 RB. Iron 452 heads, pump gas, flat tappet cam
10.24 @ 128, 1.36 60', 10sec440, 440RB 452 heads 590cam pump gas 3400#
10.325 @ 128.36, 1.405 60', weedlayer, ugly year, sb Challenger, 3430#
10.40 @ 129.1, a10sec70cuda, 446 cid, 3700#, all motor street car, through mufflers on 10.5"
10.45 @ 127, StrokerPost 67 Dart Sedan, 414 SB, 3290#, factory iron heads, all motor.
10.50 @ 129 KOS Nick 70dart driven to the track,trw flat top,stock rod 446,iron indy head 1050dom 3500#.
10.50 @ 126.68 1.40 60' dustyswinger 73 duster 416sb pumpgas ported cast iron smogger heads 3250# all motor
10.50 @ 127.00, daron 73 duster, sb street car
10.52 @ 130, BB70DUSTER, 400 stock bottom end w/ E heads on squeeze, and on pump gas
10.52 @ 127, 1.46 60', TC67CUDA,500cid,w/E heads thru mufflers street car on DOT's
10.53 @ 128.5, DaveS 73 Swinger 446 906's auto, S/S springs

10.54 @ 124, 2933lbs 590cam,1968 dart 365ci mildly ported iron heads on alcohol Dare dude
10.58 @ 126.78,1.528, T748, 68 Dart 493 w/MCH CNC Eddies
10.59 @ 124, 1.45 60', mopar65, 65 Plymouth 3500# 446 w/E heads
10.64 @ 124.50, 1.49 60', RVA, 440ci 3165#
10.65 @ 123.43 1.45 60ft 68 Dart,3160lbs,crate 360 W2 heads,904,s/s springs,10 1/2 inch slicks,mufflers, 11secdart
10.68 @ 128.3, 1.54 60', TimMoffett, 69 Charger, 4-speed Street Car, 3900# with full exhaust
10.69 @ 126.46, MFR440, '65 Coronet, 446, Max Wedge, Beachy Eng, A&A Trans, 1.50 60', 3535 lbs.
10.70 @ 125 60' 1.50 3700 race weight 10secGTX
10.76 @ 124, Mopartony, 68 Dart 470cid, 727
10.77 @ 123.9, 69Dart,1.49 60 ft, 3100 DA
10.78 @ 124 w/ 1.53 60ft... 72Challenger, 4211lbs Challenger w/ 528Hemi, STREETCAR
10.86 @ 118, 85 Camaro SB 385cid 3380Lbs P/Windows all steel street legal & driven (let off)
10.95 @ 122.22, 1.55 60' Bubba, '80 Mirada, 440, 3615#
10.98 @ 125.98, 1.54 60' 472 Hemi, 71 GTX 3900# SUNROOFGTX
10.98 @ 120.97, 1.48 60', TonyS451, '65 Coronet wagon, pump gas 470" street cruiser, 4020#

---11 second Zone ---
11.01 @ 122.38 , 1.57 60', 493Charger, 68 Charger R/T auto. 493" 3750# w/o driver
11.24 @ 119.3, 1.58 60', ZIPPY '69 GTX Street Car, 451CI,
11.26 @ 119, 1.51 60', fast68plymouth, 68 Satellite, 383, 3675#
11.296 @ 120.209, 1.514 60', Mark Gates, 7.14 1/8, iron head 451/727/3.91 8 3/4 #3765 AMC Pacer
11.33 @ 118.9, 1.60 60', LAR_414, 1969 Dart GT, 3350# race wt, 414 stroked smallblock w/ factory J heads, solid cam and pump gas
11.40 @ 121.80, 1.63 60', aarlucas, '70 cuda, 451"6 PK, 3700#, 2.5" exh sys,pump gas, 3.91, auto
11.40 @ 119.18, w2_360duster, 375 ci w2 no nos thru mufflers @ 3000 ft alt. 3020# w/o driver
11.43 @ 119 1.65 60' 440FISH 72 Demon 383stroker(454ci), 4000stall, 3.73, 452heads,hyd. cam, and fuel injection.
11.46 @ 115 1.55 60' Don1 75 Duster 360 3000# w/driver
11.50 @ 115 1.55 60' 68DART360 ,904, 3200 lbs,eheads, pump gas,full exhaust, 10" tire SS springs
11.533@116.32 1.542 60' 6PKBEE 77 Aspen R/T 360/904/4.10 3425#
11.55 @ 116.23 , 1.62 , 60 , 383man's sons 406 Dart pump gas street car.
11.598 @ 106.690 1.67 60' 67 Charger 440 3600# 8to1 iron head pump gas RemCharger
11.60 @ 116-69 superbee 440-6 pack-3800# BEEQUICK
11.62 @ 114 mph, 1.64 60' in a 3300# 69 fast back cuda street car...Phill
11.67 @ 116 RoadRnnr69, 1969 RoadRunner 500 stroker, auto 4:10 gears Street tires, full exhaust , 93 octane.
11.702 @ 113.85, CudaDan, 1.565 60 ft, 360 auto
11.708 @ 114.24, 1.674 60', tboomer '64 Dodge 330 sedan, 3460# 446" 3.91 gears...
11.72 @ 113, 440Jim, '73 Cuda, 3700#, hyd cam, 446CID, street
11.76 @113.8, 1.588 60', 77 Volare, 400/727 3660#
11.78 @ 114, Sledgehammer, '71 Dart Swinger, 3470#, 366ci J-headed Small Block 904 Auto on street tires
11.80 @ 113.45, Runner 1.645 60' 452ci stock heads xe282s comp solid. 71 roadrunner 3750 lb w/d
11.84 @ 117.25 1.755 60` Scatpk 68 GTX 528 Hemi 4spd 354 gear 4175lbs w/driver 10.1 comp 242/242@50 solid cam factory intake TTI Headers 91 octane
11.85 @ 116.6, 1.65 60', 68LAR, '68 Road Runner 3926#, 4 SPEED street car

Granted there are a few exceptions like the 6 second status and the 8 second omni, but when I think of muscle cars thats generally where my thoughts lead.
I don't even consider my 02 mustang a muscle car, I would call it a sports car or pony car, I see the vette as a sports car.

2Mopars1Ford

12-24-2005, 09:39 AM

It doesn't have to be 11 sec or quicker either alot of muscle cars ran 13's and 14's There just wasnt enough charachters allowed to let me post the full list :P

99SL2_Modder

12-25-2005, 01:40 PM

I would like to put in my 2 cents on the viper displacement debate:

Obviously, Dodge completely set a new bound when they came out with the viper v10 in 1995. 10 years later, everyone STILL says, "OMG, this has less displacement and MORE HORSEPOWER!!!" Even though the viper engine is 10 years old, everyone still benchmarks it. They haven't changed a thing about it.

Moral of the story?
Older things have a tendency to still benchmark newer cars. Stop looking at old technology and think of what Dodge COULD do to that car with the amount of technology they have NOW. They could easily spank the vette and any car out there, but they leave the huge v10 in there instead.

You all need to grow up. Yes there are things faster than american muscle. There are still very few american muscle cars on this site, so stop calling your 1985+ car muscle...it's not.

Yes there's things faster than German/Euro/Jap cars. Stop swinging on their nuts.

You guys really gotta stop siding with one side or another. It's a worthless debate. They all have good qualities.

PA Z06

02-19-2007, 04:37 PM

Wow long thread,
I figured Id throw in my .02 cents.
Ive had my Z06 for almost three years now, and its def not refined. It came stock with 365hp to the wheels, and weighed in at 3130 with 3/4 tank of gas, but it will spank 98% of the cars on the road w/o having to do a burn out first in a straight line, and bring it onto the road course and thats where it truely shines. I didnt buy this car for refinement or amenities, I bought it because its a bargain. Most of my boys all push German cars, so I am a car fan in general, but when I get into my brothers C4s the car is outstanding in every single way. Will it beat my Z06 in a race nope, but to him its not all about the numbers.
Another thing that no one has mentioned is Torque. You can have a ton of HP and you will need every bit of it to beat an equal weight car that has more torque.
So in short if your a baller buy whatever makes you happy, if not buy what you can afford that will make you happy, and as mentioned before there will always be something faster.
My buddies always tease me because My saying is "ITs all about the numbers" and I only say that because I drive a vette with a weak ass interior.

Raven18940

02-19-2007, 06:13 PM

Another thing that no one has mentioned is Torque. You can have a ton of HP and you will need every bit of it to beat an equal weight car that has more torque.

Torque is not the end all, be all of racing. Far more important than torque is the area under the Power curve. Broad power > peaky power. However the huge mountain of mid range torque the tappers off as the revs build is what gives american muscle (and my saab) a nice, broad power band.

PA Z06

02-19-2007, 08:48 PM

[QUOTE=Raven18940;457829]Torque is not the end all, be all of racing.

I didnt think I implied torque is the end all, be all of racing ?

wgknestrick

02-19-2007, 10:47 PM

Got to love muscle cars but; if Chevy could pull the hp per liter that Hondas formula 1 Car does a standard 302 motor would be pushing something around 3200hp.

How did we fall so far behind the rest of the world in engines and technology?

NASCAR.

Every other country has a legitimate race series where they actually race stockish cars with stockish engines. This helps to further develop that countries' technology within it's manufactures.

We have tube frame cars with carb'd V8s:roll:

Raven18940

02-19-2007, 11:19 PM

I didnt think I implied torque is the end all, be all of racing ?

Hmmmmm, I guess not, not sure why I went on that little rant. :(

twistedlanes

03-13-2007, 09:29 PM

I have a question. I just read all of these posts and I wanted to know, if an srt-4 isn't muscle and these 84+ cars aren't muscle what exactly are they? They definitely aren't tuners, well maybe an srt-4 but the sound it makes kinda rules that out, and as far as anything being faster, I think we have to define what we mean by fast. What form of fast are we looking for drag fast, x-cross fast the Nurburgring thing fast etc. I just want something that'll beat my friends at the track but you may want something else....

oh and on the Viper..M3...etc. thing I'ma have to agree with the last couple of posts, it depends on your tastes, your budget and your agenda.

enigma

03-13-2007, 10:38 PM

Most of the 84+ cars were so restricted by smog crap that you were pretty much screwed when it came to power mods. Excluding the GN's and a few other cars.
I would consider certain G- an f bodies musclecars, with the right mods.
It all depends on what your tastes are. There are even a few cars out of the late 70's that look "okay"
On the whole HP per litre deal, you add a can add a big honkin turbo to a 347 ford stroker, and wind up in the neighborhood of 1600 hp. Thats around 290 hp/liter. With a torque band to match. Thats really a moot point, hp/litre. Just about any motor can make insane power, just depends on what you are willing to do to it. Once you reace a certain point of power to displacement, its gonna cost you buku bucks anyway you look at it. Case in point, my 428 stroker motor is gonna cost me around 15g's in the end, but when all is said and done, i'll have well over a thousand hp if I decide to go forced induction. Power that i can romp on at the track and will nearly never have to worry about stuff breaking.
Don't get me wrong, i like my talon, but there is nothing like stabbing the pedal of a car with gobs of torque, and gobs of hp to match. The things just get up and go.
On euro cars, people want power with all the creature comforts, thats why they pay through the nose for them(and taxes too)
I like the fact that up until a year ago, there was still an "american" company offering a cheap well power'd car.

Reidonly

07-22-2007, 04:37 PM

The only thing is they are just big ass V-8's prducing horsepower when my puny 2.0 Turbo can make as much power as alot of these 4.6, 5.0 or bigger engines, therefore the 2.0 engine is way more efficient the liter to horsepower ratio is way bigger

also think that with todays gasoline prices we are seein more efficient smaller engines producing as much if not more power as the big old school boys
My 350hp "old school muscle" got 27mpg on my last trip to NY doing 85-90mph the whole way, passing people without using cruise, with the AC on full blast (in August at that) and a trunk full of luggage.

If I actually used cruise and kept it around 70-75mph, 29-30mpg is more than easily attainable in these cars.:wiggle:

Buster

07-22-2007, 04:54 PM

There is no such thing as muscle anymore. Its the truth and people should get used to it. Muscle cars were sheer unbridled power with no real comforts. Wheat do we consider muscle now? Late camaros/firebirds/TAs, Vettes, Cobras, Vipers, and GTOs? wheres the sheer power. where is the large displacement and roll down windows. The viper is the only thing that comes close to it and is still closer to a super car than anything. the muscle car era died back in the late 70s its not coming back. technology is whats driving anything now.

ITSTOCK

07-23-2007, 09:47 PM

Yes, muscle cars are defined by early 60's through early 70's, that were basically only meant to go fast in a straight line. It's the days when you could get a no options, factory race car that was allowed to drive on the street.

Needless to say, they haven't been around in a while. And the Viper was designed to compete with super cars, is a 2 seater, a "sports car". It was originally conceived to bring back the idea of a muscle car, but a muscle car it isn't.

BTW, my 03 cobra got over 20mpg around town and upper 20's on the highway. I would say that is pretty good for a 4000#, 550rwhp (660rwhp on spray) car. I would say that a STOCK BLOCK (100% unopened) 4.6litre making well over 660rwhp (I never got it dynoed with the new blower, but had used the same shot on the street, so it was probably more like 700rwhp) is pretty good. There have been 100% untouched 03 cobra engines that are making 900rwhp RELIABLY (and there still are, just go to modularfords.com), and over 1100rwhp (actually some have hit closer to 1500rwhp with only 4.6).

You have to remember that your little 2.0 is in a 2000# car, while the 4.6 is in a 4000# car. Apples to oranges, but in the end, sure, it's close to the same when you take in relative PERCENTAGES AND RATIOS.

ToTheIX's

07-24-2007, 12:43 AM

actually the curb weights are about 3263 compared to 3665....but yea, im not goin back into all the posts and arguing.....i just have to stand up for the evo, its required

ITSTOCK

07-24-2007, 02:35 PM

actually the curb weights are about 3263 compared to 3665....but yea, im not goin back into all the posts and arguing.....i just have to stand up for the evo, its required

It was an obvious exaggeration, but point is, two different kind of cars, one of which is considerably heavier. Also, the newest Evo's that are out right now have a curb weight of right below 3100 loaded, the older ones (92???) were well under 3000, closer to 2700. At least using comparable data (from equal sites) to compare.

1_badimport

07-24-2007, 11:45 PM

ther is no comparison ..eventually when you get older and find out that imports are good for driving to and from work and as a weekend beater ..you just cannot compete with the sbc ..especially rwd ..
if you want to go fast and have great handling the baddest /cheapest cars on the road are swapped fd rx7,s with ls1/ls6 motors light quick,relable power and handling ..
if you want to beat your buddy at the track get a mustang best bang for buck around ..imports are great to a certain point then they show ther weaknesses ...fragile parts and breakage ..
theres arguments for how baad my evo is bu tthe really fast one cost an arm and a leg and dont stay together long ..
i have hundreds of passes on my v8 rx7 w/o problems running in the high 8,s there are verry few imports that can boast that ..

Mach1

08-16-2007, 05:54 PM

how about a 450HP 1.8L turbo AWD Ford? that does 0-60 in 2seconds flat?

from 1986........

Google: RS200 Evo :)

PhillyLS1

08-16-2007, 08:35 PM

with all the crap I have done I still get 26mpg.

However I don't really even care about that. I care what the scoreboard flashes at the end of the 1/4, what it beats light to light, and how it affects my wallet getting there. I still have my stock trans after a jizzilion 1/4 and dyno passes and 600+ hp.
I also feel like less moving parts is more reliable. 1 cam, 1 time'n chain, 16 valves. Super efficient? No. Fast? Yes. Reliable? Yes. Expensive? No.

fsburnout216

02-05-2008, 08:25 PM

i dont care what anyone thinks. cause me personally will never drive one of those silly little 4 cylinder toys. american muscle sounds better then any engine out there. how many video are there of people throwing LS7s into anything they can. and LS1s go into like everything. looks good sounds good and makes the entire car shake at an idle. cant be beat

Signatus230

02-05-2008, 09:08 PM

xEJ20x

02-05-2008, 09:48 PM

Ugh....this thread again.....:roll:

Instigator1225

02-06-2008, 05:34 PM

Evo8kid

02-06-2008, 09:41 PM

my internet is faster

Keeper1343

02-07-2008, 01:58 PM

i dont feel like readin all the pages... But the Srt's and Cobalts are definitly NOT muscle. They are tuner cars. Just like honda, Subies etc... I personally don't like to own muscle cars cause its all bark no bite (for the most part). They have these huge motors that sound nice but don't do anything. Not to mention all the gas guzzling while they are doing nothing. I simply don't like them cause they lack technology. Not to start anything but you can take a civic and put a H22 in it with a B series trans and turbo with stock internals and run what?? i think low 11's high 10's if you can get the power to the ground. Still pulling off about 20-25 MPG

05GT

02-07-2008, 08:49 PM

all i have to say is ...

5200 bucks
10.48 at 14X.XX
4 banger
driven daily

pwns american muscle.

I think this thread is just lame, but seriously, your comment is just retarded.

I can put less than $5k into my car, make it run 10's and still daily drive it.

Plus, I'd like to know exactly what 4 cyl car you are talking about? Not because I don't think it can be done, but because I think you are leaving out details.

xEJ20x

02-07-2008, 09:44 PM

sean3

02-07-2008, 11:27 PM

ITSTOCK

02-07-2008, 11:34 PM

I just want to know where the myth comes from that modern "muscle cars" get bad gas mileage?

Go buy an 03 cobra or LSx car, get 600+rwhp, and still get 20/27mpg.

Now go buy a 4 banger, do all the work that you need to get 600+rwhp, and get better than 20/27mpg.

Other than that, this thread really is retarded.

deb38

02-08-2008, 01:32 AM

I think people equate V8's with the larger engines that are in SUV's, which only get 15mpg

btw a 600 wheel 4banger can prolly get more mpg than you...all it has to do is stay out of boost, which would be fairly easy considering it's not gonna hit boost til 5k

DPancoast

02-08-2008, 01:57 AM

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 01:58 AM

I think this thread is just lame, but seriously, your comment is just retarded.

I can put less than $5k into my car, make it run 10's and still daily drive it.

Plus, I'd like to know exactly what 4 cyl car you are talking about? Not because I don't think it can be done, but because I think you are leaving out details.

how is my comment retarded?

u put less than 5 k into your car and get tens... congrads... your starting out with a way better platform... 5k.. a set of slicks.. the right parts and some spray id hope u could touch 9's

.. you didnt get the part that 5200 was including the price OF the car... or the part where the motor had who knows how many miles on it...

and the 4 banger i am talking about was driven daily for almost three years and made 707 to the wheel. and def got a good 30+ mpg when not in boost..

heres a vid.....

http://videos.clevelandracing.com/recentvideos/2/ebd010e6-d174-4a2c-8a95-994d008f47dd.htm

ill find some pics and post them here in a few mins.... lemme search .. right quick

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 02:05 AM

**** pictures... heres a walk around and a good ****ing show of what it does...

http://videos.clevelandracing.com/video/986baca8-70c7-4108-bd06-99ce00ee0e0b.htm

DPancoast

02-08-2008, 02:10 AM

they crashed!? wow...... he goes "there goes that" lol

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 02:11 AM

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 02:12 AM

they crashed!? wow...... he goes "there goes that" lol

it was a sad day.... that ok.. hes built somthing far faster lol...

4g63 powered of course.

05GT

02-08-2008, 10:07 AM

.. you didnt get the part that 5200 was including the price OF the car... or the part where the motor had who knows how many miles on it...

and the 4 banger i am talking about was driven daily for almost three years and made 707 to the wheel. and def got a good 30+ mpg when not in boost..

Ok, but I'm sure it was gutted, and I highly doubt the car was only $5200 with all the work done, maybe someone bought it for that much, but whoever originally did the work I'm sure spent more then $5200 for the car plus the work.

And did you own the car? Did you drive it and record it's mpg? I doubt it got 30mpg. Is that what you read or was told...and so it must be right?

And I don't get this whole thing anyway. I think we all know you can take any POS car and make it a fast POS car. It still is a POS.

And as far as mpg, if I don't boost, I can get 25-26mpg in my Cobra.

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 11:36 AM

Ok, but I'm sure it was gutted, and I highly doubt the car was only $5200 with all the work done, maybe someone bought it for that much, but whoever originally did the work I'm sure spent more then $5200 for the car plus the work.

And did you own the car? Did you drive it and record it's mpg? I doubt it got 30mpg. Is that what you read or was told...and so it must be right?

And I don't get this whole thing anyway. I think we all know you can take any POS car and make it a fast POS car. It still is a POS.

And as far as mpg, if I don't boost, I can get 25-26mpg in my Cobra.

did u not watch the frikkin videos? gutted from the two front seats back...

and when u do your own tuning and BUILD the car your self u can do alot for cheap.. sorry if you don't possess the knowledge or skill to do either.

and no i didnt own the car... i only know the kid who owned it...went on a few decent road trips.. kinda was around it ......alot....its simple ****ing math..... if i have say a 13 gallon fuel cell.. and i go from Cleveland to Cincinnati ...and fill up once... its not that hard to figure out gas millage.

and you dont get the whole making a POS fast because you own a ****ing cobra....typical egotistic mustang owners.. its everyone else that gets it when a piece of **** walks on your ****ing stocker cobra... then sees your face and laughs.... ...and the best part is.. if u blow it up.. wreck it...u dont have to give a **** because it was ****ing cheap..

congratulations .. your comment was retarded.

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 11:41 AM

and if you think its that easy to build a 700 hp car for that cheap... id love to see you try... because as far as i am concerned everyone would have 5 of them if it was.

SpEcRv9

02-08-2008, 02:01 PM

that colt is a fast car....too bad that guy didnt know at 190mph....especially in a ****in colt....you cant just let off the gas that fast.

DPancoast

02-08-2008, 04:18 PM

haha this thread is going downhill faster than a fat kid falling off a cliff with no parachute.

deb38

02-08-2008, 04:21 PM

^sweet, post that vid.

05GT

02-08-2008, 04:56 PM

did u not watch the frikkin videos? gutted from the two front seats back...

and when u do your own tuning and BUILD the car your self u can do alot for cheap.. sorry if you don't possess the knowledge or skill to do either.

and no i didnt own the car... i only know the kid who owned it...went on a few decent road trips.. kinda was around it ......alot....its simple ****ing math..... if i have say a 13 gallon fuel cell.. and i go from Cleveland to Cincinnati ...and fill up once... its not that hard to figure out gas millage.

and you dont get the whole making a POS fast because you own a ****ing cobra....typical egotistic mustang owners.. its everyone else that gets it when a piece of **** walks on your ****ing stocker cobra... then sees your face and laughs.... ...and the best part is.. if u blow it up.. wreck it...u dont have to give a **** because it was ****ing cheap..

congratulations .. your comment was retarded.

My post is retarded when you can't even say something to me without cursing or spelling something wrong....yeah guess you're a real genius!

And once again, I love how people resort to bringing my car into an arguement. It has nothing to do with what I own or what I know. I've owned crap cars in the past.

It's not the point. And once again, I still say you can't build a car that fast for that cheap. PERIOD.

I don't care if people can beat my car. Once again, I RARELY talk about it, and I don't even have a member journal. My car isn't stock, but I don't broadcast it.

It's morons like you who are the sterotypical people. It's not me being a typical Mustang owner....

all i have to say is ...

5200 bucks
10.48 at 14X.XX
4 banger
driven daily

pwns american muscle.

Yeah real mature buddy.

ITSTOCK

02-08-2008, 05:29 PM

what work?

eagle rods...je pistons....big turbo and fuel... and see what happens.

BOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol, so other than an entirely new engine, drive train, and supporting fuel system.....

Some of you import guys crack me up as much as some of the domestic car guys. You're all a bunch of morons.

DPancoast

02-08-2008, 06:04 PM

I think its safe to say that all car owners are morons in some respect.

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 07:47 PM

BOOOOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol, so other than an entirely new engine, drive train, and supporting fuel system.....

Some of you import guys crack me up as much as some of the domestic car guys. You're all a bunch of morons.

nahhh dsm link and some race gas at 32 psi produces good numbers so far

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 07:51 PM

It's not the point. And once again, I still say you can't build a car that fast for that cheap. PERIOD.

then your a stubborn idiot ..... guess u dont realize it pays to know people who can give you good deals... sorry your ignorance doesnt let you see this.

.

It's morons like you who are the sterotypical people. It's not me being a typical Mustang owner....

and where have i been a moron?

i am stating a fact that has brought 5 cars such as this to the power levels they are produce and you think your a ****ing car god and telling me i am wrong when i have seen it first hand...apparently it is your duty to try and call bull**** on me?

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 07:52 PM

that colt is a fast car....too bad that guy didnt know at 190mph....especially in a ****in colt....you cant just let off the gas that fast.

didnt let off the gas... air got underneath it and lifted it up ... same thing happened with this colt as well...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=E1vrpBZv7bk

they are far to light to be going that fast....

05GT

02-08-2008, 07:54 PM

i am stating a fact that has brought 5 cars such as this to the power levels they are produce and you think your a ****ing car god and telling me i am wrong when i have seen it first hand...apparently it is your duty to try and call bull**** on me?

Someone's angry eh?

Car god? Nope, far from it. But I do have a great idiot sense detector.

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 08:12 PM

ThePrimerSuspect

02-08-2008, 08:15 PM

lets go back in time a year ago and throw a v6 mustang into the mix:roll:

05GT

02-08-2008, 09:13 PM

id love to see how you are proving i am an idiot?

minus the fact that i have a car thats way cheaper.. and yet still faster than yours... whatever...

and your calling bs on a proven fact.. i know what he spent into the car... i know the deals he got and where he got them... and your still calling bs.. so do what you will.

and far from angry... ...your just another ****ing d bag who owns a mustang. congratulations.

Oh boy...you have a car that's faster then mine (even though you have no idea what my car has done or how fast it is)....congratulations, you've accomplished so much in life. :thumbup: :roll:

You're an idiot because you can't put down any facts or a good arguement. All you throw around are insults and curses. And you seem to be very angry when all I originally said was that your comment of "pwns american muscle" was as stupid as the thread. Hence my comment, "anything can be made fast". It doens't mean it "pwns" anything.

But you can have the last word, cuz I'm done in here. I don't have time to play anymore.

DPancoast

02-08-2008, 09:23 PM

lets go back in time a year ago and throw a v6 mustang into the mix:roll:

I raced one of them and WON OMGZ 4 BANGERZ

Instigator1225

02-08-2008, 09:29 PM

Oh boy...you have a car that's faster then mine (even though you have no idea what my car has done or how fast it is)....congratulations, you've accomplished so much in life. :thumbup: :roll:

You're an idiot because you can't put down any facts or a good arguement. All you throw around are insults and curses. And you seem to be very angry when all I originally said was that your comment of "pwns american muscle" was as stupid as the thread. Hence my comment, "anything can be made fast". It doens't mean it "pwns" anything.

But you can have the last word, cuz I'm done in here. I don't have time to play anymore.

i dont need to know what u have done...because unless your spraying the hell out of it or are fully built i wouldnt waste my time.

and how am i an idiot? what facts have i left out? minus where the kid works or his exact map for the tune?

i dont see how u cant see that he bought everything for less than 5200 bucks.. tuned it him self.. made said horse power....with a 42r@ 33 psi.... i jsut dont see where there lack of thought process is coming here.

and the pwns american muscle was jsut a comment going with the thread.. that one of the few 4 bangers on the street that even form a dig had the top end to go around most street car... so it did its job... dont see where your confused about that..

is there somthing faster? most definatly.

ozthunder

02-09-2008, 12:35 AM

WHO THE **** CARES.

People like what they like, let it be!

Instigator1225

02-09-2008, 02:32 AM

WHO THE **** CARES.

People like what they like, let it be!

x2 .......

Keeper1343

02-09-2008, 10:18 PM

this thread should have been locked a long time ago

dragonfly2k3

02-10-2008, 12:04 AM

Lol at this thread. Any car can be fast. Im with 05cobra. You can make a 10sec colt, its still a colt. Sure its a cool track car, but who wants to daily a gutted 10sec car? Not I.

Keeper1343

02-10-2008, 12:10 AM

unless its a full interior H2B turbo haha.

Instigator1225

02-10-2008, 04:24 AM

lol... u guys jsut dont get it.. whatever lol

dragonfly2k3

02-10-2008, 02:26 PM

lol... u guys jsut dont get it.. whatever lol

I do get it, you can build a 10sec car for under 6k. I love the 4g, trust me. The fact of the matter is you can build a 1g that blows the doors off a vette for less than half the price. You're still driving a 1g dsm though. The interior isnt as nice, its not as reliable, its not as good looking, and certainly doesnt get recognized nearly as much as a vette. Theres a reason nicer cars cost more, they're nicer.

ITSTOCK

02-10-2008, 04:05 PM

lol... u guys jsut dont get it.. whatever lol

You sure do have a chip on your shoulder.

Zarno

02-10-2008, 07:54 PM

WHO THE **** CARES.

People like what they like, let it be!

Quoted for troof. Drive what you like and let others do the same

HickRocket1258

02-11-2008, 12:15 PM

I love this thread. Screw those little 4 bangers with their power adders haha.

Keeper1343

02-11-2008, 12:21 PM

I love this thread. Screw those little 4 bangers with their power adders haha.

All i have to say is that I only have 134 C.I. That says it all haha

Instigator1225

02-11-2008, 09:31 PM

You sure do have a chip on your shoulder.

nahh not really a chip... just a dislike for people who cant appreciate all cars and what they do...

ITSTOCK

02-11-2008, 10:51 PM

nahh not really a chip... just a dislike for people who cant appreciate all cars and what they do...

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i125/Blogger-Sandi/Misc/pot-kettle-black.jpg

i dont need to know what u have done...because unless your spraying the hell out of it or are fully built i wouldnt waste my time.

minus the fact that i have a car thats way cheaper.. and yet still faster than yours... whatever...

your just another ****ing d bag who owns a mustang. congratulations.

sorry if you don't possess the knowledge or skill to do either.

and you dont get the whole making a POS fast because you own a ****ing cobra.

its everyone else that gets it when a piece of **** walks on your ****ing stocker cobra... then sees your face and laughs.... ...and the best part is.. if u blow it up.. wreck it...u dont have to give a **** because it was ****ing cheap..

all i have to say is ...

5200 bucks
10.48 at 14X.XX
4 banger
driven daily

pwns american muscle.

I don't know, it sure sounds like you've got a chip on your shoulder.

dragonfly2k3

02-12-2008, 12:01 AM

Instigator1225

02-12-2008, 01:55 AM

lol, pwned. Also, nobody is dis-respecting gods gift to the automotive world(the dodge colt lol) We are simply saying that the cobra is equally good in its own way. If anything you are the only person in here that doesnt have respect for both car. Congrats, you're a typical fanboi who thinks that the only good cars in the world are ones he can afford. lol.

lol ... ok lets set this straight.

the only point i was trying to get across was that for far far cheaper you could go just as fast if not faster than v8 powered car.

does the mustang still look better at the end of the day... yep ill totally agree to that. I still prefer the sound of like a 4.6 mod motor with a huge procharger on it to the sound of modded 03-04 cobra...but looks there awsome. especially a black or the mystic cobras....and i am not taking away form the performance.. it jsut comes down to personal taste. Id rather mod an f body before a mustang..but then again thats personal preference. My whole idea on this is.. if i destroy a 5k car.. i could care less if i go and blow what 26k on say an 03 cobra.. plus the cost to mod it... and i destroy hat.. yeah i am going to be pretty pissed off.

and as far as being a fanboy.... i dont see how i am a fan boy? I drive a 93 formula thats got a decent amount of work... an 07 si (stock).. and two bastardly swapped cars.. an 88 isuzu and a 240(91 s13)...and a few others i dont care to discuss with this group... so i dont see a fanboy status here....i mean if your saying i couldnt afford a cobra, i dont know where that comes from.. but whatever..... I jsut picked the colts because up here in north east ohio.. they are quite the little ****ers for a 60 roll.

05GT

02-12-2008, 09:05 AM

blah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahbl ahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahbl ahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahbl ahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahbl ahblahblah
i couldnt afford a cobrablahblahblahblah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahbl ahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah

:rotfl: Sorry just couldn't resist.

I seriously don't even know how or why this turned into a discussion on the Cobra. I simply used it once as an example since I know first hand. That is all.

ozthunder

02-12-2008, 09:07 AM

Alex's rocket ship > your cobra.

/thread

1gmfanatik

02-12-2008, 09:24 AM

American Muscle... Camaro, Corvette, Mustang, Chevelle, Charger, ect... The Heritage to American Muscle will NEVER be a small displacement high revving motor. That just isn't the American way. Sorry, but no matter what anyone says, the SRT4, Cobalt (Supercharger or Turbocharged, the turbo version is coming out this year) and whatever other little motor having pocket rocket that we have, will never be TRUE American Muscle.

Don't get it twisted, I loved and do kinda miss my Cobalt, I have been through my fair share of Chevy Beretta's, and Cavaliers (They would surprise you..lol) and numerous other vehicles, but it is what it is...

By the way...I AM GM all the way soo... All I have to say is.... Corvette ZR1(650hp), New Camaro(LS3 base V8 motor), Pontiac G8(LS3), Chevy HHR SS (Turbo 260hp) Chevy Cobalt SS/TC (Turbo 260hp) Cadillac CTS V(550hp) Pontiac G6 GXP (252hp 251tq) Yup, yup..Gotta Love It

ozthunder

02-12-2008, 09:27 AM

ZR1= 620-30hp, And the Camaro is rumored to get the LS2? Unless they finally declared it's powerplant.

And the G8 doesn't get the LS3.

1gmfanatik

02-12-2008, 11:06 AM

ZR1= 620-30hp, And the Camaro is rumored to get the LS2? Unless they finally declared it's powerplant.

And the G8 doesn't get the LS3.

Highly doubt the Camaro is getting the LS2, they are working on phasing it out and phasing the LS3 in. I can check the brochure tonight, you might be correct about the G8, THAT might be getting the LS2 since it is going to be on the showroom floors next month.

Either way, that is a hell of a nasty list of GM rides that are comin out.

deb38

02-12-2008, 11:52 AM

Mach1

02-14-2008, 10:42 AM

All I have to say in this thread is....

CCX 806hp 4.7L based on the 4v 4.6L Ford Mod motor, standing 1/4 in 9.9sec

Keeper1343

02-14-2008, 03:28 PM

and that motor costs????

ozthunder

02-14-2008, 03:31 PM

More than any of our houses.

Keeper1343

02-14-2008, 03:42 PM

exactly lol... i can't even imagine what my uncles 752 alluminum Indy motor costs. He said something like 10-15K for an EMPTY block. i was like WTF ur crazy

Mach1

02-14-2008, 06:10 PM

ok so the ccR has a high price motor....not really....

$6500 you can get the 4.6L version that will take 650WHP...or get the 15k GT500 motor that takes over 1200whp and over 1000wtq on stock internals, heads and cams.

dragonfly2k3

02-14-2008, 08:44 PM

New audi RS6 ... twin turbo V-10. 650hp untuned. Did I mention it was a wagon, has leather, navigation, carbon fiber trim and a million other things you won't find in either a cobalt, colt, vette, cobra?

= ) Euro ftw

you have obviously never purchased parts for a euro. I saw a vw fuel pump today that costs 1100 dollars. Are you kidding me? I could buy more than 11 for an other car for that much, wtf.

Keeper1343

02-14-2008, 09:14 PM

go see what VW wires cost.... i think they were 150 for 4 of them. I hated my Golf mostly for that reason.

Mach1

02-15-2008, 10:47 AM

yeah my friend spend over $1200 getting his new GTi tuned with the tunes he wants and the flasher ect.... just for the tuning...

I spend $1200 and got exhaust, tune(that I can adjust not just the tuning shop) and intake LOL.

for the cost of him to get his VW into the 13's with chip and exhaust, I can have full bolt-ons and be running DEEP 12's. He needs to spend over 2,300 just to get to where I was bone stock. In a car that brand new...only cost 5k less then mine.

VW part pricing is CRAZY stupid.

1gmfanatik

02-15-2008, 11:14 AM

Less then a grand and I'm runnin high 12's with my 4600lb SUV..

deb38

02-15-2008, 11:35 AM

you have obviously never purchased parts for a euro. I saw a vw fuel pump today that costs 1100 dollars. Are you kidding me? I could buy more than 11 for an other car for that much, wtf.

Believe me, I know the cost.

1gmfanatik

02-15-2008, 11:50 AM

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/c56c1095-c945-43f9-a9ed-9a3f013594b4.htm

Here you go...American Made

Keeper1343

02-15-2008, 01:30 PM

holy crap ^^^^^

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 08:51 PM

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 08:53 PM

Yes, there is. It's called a Skyline. http://www.aaroncarr.com/images/smileys/fawk.gif

The most disturbing Skyline I've ever heard of is over 1200 bhp and did over 200 mph through Tokyo.

Amazing, when you consider that it's still a street car. :eek:

Man....you need to look around on some domestic boards....you act like a 1000+HP street car is 1 in 10,000,000,000

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 08:55 PM

It was an exaggeration...the new viper is 8.3L V10 510hp, new vette 7.0L V8 505hp, whereas a 5.7L V10 porsche carrera GT puts down 605hp, 4.3L V8 ferrari puts down 490hp, etc. Much smaller displacement with as much or more power.

490 crank HP huh...how much RWTRQ???

peteyturbo

04-19-2008, 09:18 PM

thats a typical question you already know the answer to..mabye 300 if its lucky..I'd take the sound of the engine and HP over torque anyday, and its a ferrari!490 crank HP huh...how much RWTRQ???

slavetothemuzic

04-19-2008, 09:20 PM

Man....you need to look around on some domestic boards....

Why would I spend time on forums for cars that I care next to nothing about?

you act like a 1000+HP street car is 1 in 10,000,000,000
Right. They're everywhere. :roll:

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 09:26 PM

Why would I spend time on forums for cars that I care next to nothing about?

Right. They're everywhere. :roll:

start looking on some other forums....Up in the Ne we have a bad street racing scene. Go south to GA, FLA, or Texas and a 9 second car is slow.

PS I'm by no means a domestic lover.....I've owned all types and will continue to own all types of cars. I think I might dump my current car for a turbo Exige. I find it funny how dumb brand loyalist sound.
My car will put down 850 on race gas and it is by no means the fastest street car in my area. My buddy just sold his 720+ RWHP Whipple cobra that he drove on the street 6 months ago. 1,000 hp doesn't mean shjit if you can't hook....so I'll switch this up to their are a ton of 9 second cars on the street. open your eyen and look past a 240 buddy.

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 09:31 PM

thats a typical question you already know the answer to..mabye 300 if its lucky..I'd take the sound of the engine and HP over torque anyday, and its a ferrari!

So how fast is an Enzo......were do you live? I'll give you a ride in my car on pump gas and see how much fun you can have for $35,000. Seriosely...I'll take you out in it and let you tell me what you think. Don't get me wrong ...if I could afford a ferrari I probably would drive one...but I don't consider them a fast car by any means.

slavetothemuzic

04-19-2008, 09:40 PM

start looking on some other forums....Up in the Ne we have a bad street racing scene.
1. I'm not in the NE, I'm in the NW.
2. I don't street race.

Go south to GA, FLA, or Texas and a 9 second car is slow.
Again, I'm unclear on why I should give a rats ass about cars that I don't like.

My car is getting bumped to 500 WHP in the next month. Then once I get the bottom end rebuilt, I'll be going for about 600 whp. I'll probably be stopping there because I don't feel like dropping more money on even bigger injectors which will take away from the streetable factor and a couple grand on an even more elaborate standalone ECU. Not to mention that 600 whp will still be plenty of fun with a sub 3000 lb car, and I'll still be able to pass AirCare.

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 10:00 PM

1. I'm not in the NE, I'm in the NW.
2. I don't street race.

Again, I'm unclear on why I should give a rats ass about cars that I don't like.

My car is getting bumped to 500 WHP in the next month. Then once I get the bottom end rebuilt, I'll be going for about 600 whp. I'll probably be stopping there because I don't feel like dropping more money on even bigger injectors which will take away from the streetable factor and a couple grand on an even more elaborate standalone ECU. Not to mention that 600 whp will still be plenty of fun with a sub 3000 lb car, and I'll still be able to pass AirCare.

Back to the point...you act like a 1,000+ hp street car is an act of god....we got a 1,200 Supra with in a 1/4 mile of my house. I know of at least 10 cars with in 1/2 mile that are over 700 on the street. Not all domestics 7 of them are. I'm sorry ....I just realized 240s are gods gift to non street racers:thumbup: I just find it funny how many brand loyalist are on here. So far the two stock motor I've seen take the most abuse are the Supras and the 03/04 cobra. I mean people are making 520+ RWHP on a cobra with under $1,600 in mods and it's still realiable. Seen people make over 800 on a stock block. Nissans aren't the only things out their ....grow up and don't be so ignorant

slavetothemuzic

04-19-2008, 10:17 PM

Back to the point...you act like a 1,000+ hp street car is an act of god....we got a 1,200 Supra with in a 1/4 mile of my house. I know of at least 10 cars with in 1/2 mile that are over 700 on the street.
While that's a fantastic story, I don't know you, and therefore, I don't buy it. I've seen too many people on the internet who are way too full of ****.

I'm sorry ....I just realized 240s are gods gift to non street racers:thumbup: I just find it funny how many brand loyalist are on here. Nissans aren't the only things out their ....grow up and don't be so ignorant
I just find it funny how reading comprehension pwns you. Apparently, you took me saying that I don't give a rats ass about domestics to mean that I am strictly a "Nissan guy". While it is true that I own a Nissan at the moment, that does not mean that I don't have respect for other makes or models. I love a 1200 HP Supra or an 1800 HP Viper as much as the next guy. That does not however mean that I'll be wasting my time signing up and hanging out on the ****ing Supra and Viper forums.

Now I'm done talking to you. Go talk to a bunch of your 900 hp friends up the street, or go hang on the GA, TX or FL forums for a bit.

kthxbye

TROLL

04-19-2008, 10:26 PM

slave... take a deep breath.

and phillysvt... earlier you said how fast is an enzo. i'm sure you'd kick its ass in a 1/4 mile race from a standing start, but of course there are other types of 'fast' out there (like how fast can you get a 23 year upper east side italian bombshell into the sack :-p) . i'm feeling like you know this though and understand that every car, including an enzo or a 240 have their strengths and weaknesses.

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 10:29 PM

While that's a fantastic story, I don't know you, and therefore, I don't buy it. I've seen too many people on the internet who are way too full of ****.

I just find it funny how reading comprehension pwns you. Apparently, you took me saying that I don't give a rats ass about domestics to mean that I am strictly a "Nissan guy". While it is true that I own a Nissan at the moment, that does not mean that I don't have respect for other makes or models. I love a 1200 HP Supra or an 1800 HP Viper as much as the next guy. That does not however mean that I'll be wasting my time signing up and hanging out on the ****ing Supra and Viper forums.

Now I'm done talking to you. Go talk to a bunch of your 900 hp friends up the street, or go hang on the GA, TX or FL forums for a bit.

kthxbye

Ok...I'm not full of ****...know a bunch of people on here. How old are you? The more you get into the car scene the more you will realize their are a ton of fast street cars. Hell if you saw my cobra club you would think 600 RWHP cobras grow on trees. You slammed domestics...thats a pretty broad range of cars. Go out and experience something else. Your car knowledge is lacking....I was mearly suggesting you look around before making statements. Now go finish your homework before it's your bed time.:supz:

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 10:31 PM

slave... take a deep breath.

and phillysvt... earlier you said how fast is an enzo. i'm sure you'd kick its ass in a 1/4 mile race from a standing start, but of course there are other types of 'fast' out there. i'm feeling like you know this though and understand that every car, including an enzo or a 240 have their strengths and weaknesses.

I was offering to give the guy a ride...I was talking about the $$ to fun ratio...Hell I would rock an Enzo if i could over any car I owned.

TROLL

04-19-2008, 10:34 PM

Yeah... well I'll take the ride instead :). I got a ride in and drove 05GT's Cobra last year, it was pretty fun...
And I saw an Enzo in person on the street last week for the first time at an Exotic Meet... its insane. The star of the show in a sea of well over 100 other exotics.

PhillySVT

04-19-2008, 10:35 PM

Yeah... well I'll take the ride :).
I got a ride in and drove 05GT's Cobra last year, it was pretty fun...

anytime

peteyturbo

04-20-2008, 12:31 AM

switched topic to your car; saw that coming a mile awaystart looking on some other forums....Up in the Ne we have a bad street racing scene. Go south to GA, FLA, or Texas and a 9 second car is slow.

PS I'm by no means a domestic lover.....I've owned all types and will continue to own all types of cars. I think I might dump my current car for a turbo Exige. I find it funny how dumb brand loyalist sound.
My car will put down 850 on race gas and it is by no means the fastest street car in my area. My buddy just sold his 720+ RWHP Whipple cobra that he drove on the street 6 months ago. 1,000 hp doesn't mean shjit if you can't hook....so I'll switch this up to their are a ton of 9 second cars on the street. open your eyen and look past a 240 buddy.

peteyturbo

04-20-2008, 12:35 AM

you did it again, you car must be pretty damn fast..And I'd be happy to go for a spin in that beast but I cringe when I am a passenger in a slightly powerful car let alone a boosted and built V8..Why don't you consider ferrari's fast, they are among the fastest cars in the world made today, save for the backyard drag car in a drag race..
nm you have an 03 thought it was a boosted sn-95 by the avatar
Before I got my evo I was considering one, and it truthfully is more fun, but I wanted a car with a bit more utility to drive year round.I've been in an 03 with ported blower ect. and it was downright nastySo how fast is an Enzo......were do you live? I'll give you a ride in my car on pump gas and see how much fun you can have for $35,000. Seriosely...I'll take you out in it and let you tell me what you think. Don't get me wrong ...if I could afford a ferrari I probably would drive one...but I don't consider them a fast car by any means.

peteyturbo

04-20-2008, 12:44 AM

$ to fun sure, but an enzo would put a hurtin on about any american racecar made save for the C5R Ec.tI was offering to give the guy a ride...I was talking about the $$ to fun ratio...Hell I would rock an Enzo if i could over any car I owned.

slavetothemuzic

04-20-2008, 01:44 AM

How old are you?
Old

You slammed domestics...
Seriously, grab a dictionary or something. Not care != slamming. Slamming would indicate that I actually cared enough to construct a negative argument.

PhillySVT

04-20-2008, 11:12 AM

$ to fun sure, but an enzo would put a hurtin on about any american racecar made save for the C5R Ec.t

I agree.....They have a fast top speed but thay aren't too quick. I think the run the quarter in the low 11's. Now thro it on a track and it is gonna spanck most cars. I just offered the ride so you could see what a turbo V8 is like. Way funner than my old ported eaton set up. If you are ever in the area hit me up. Do you own a Evo now? I think I might dump my daily driver for a used Evo.

PhillySVT

04-20-2008, 11:16 AM

Old

Seriously, grab a dictionary or something. Not care != slamming. Slamming would indicate that I actually cared enough to construct a negative argument.

Whatever...I see from you post that you don't have much car knowlege. I could care less....I'll live my life experincing cars from different countries and enjoy them each for what they do well. Why are you on the domestic tech forum if don't visit forums of cars you care nothing about.

slavetothemuzic

04-20-2008, 01:15 PM

Whatever...I see from you post that you don't have much car knowlege.
I love how you keep saying that, when the simple fact is, you don't know ****. Keep saying it though and maybe it will come true.

Why are you on the domestic tech forum if don't visit forums of cars you care nothing about.
I'm not. It's a sub forum of a forum that I was already registered on.

If you click "New Posts", it shows you all posts since your last visit, regardless of which sub forum you're in.

Dave

04-20-2008, 02:25 PM

Raven18940

04-20-2008, 04:03 PM

PhillySVT

04-20-2008, 05:06 PM

I think the problem with american muscle is that fans of it put it on a pedestal that never existed. Most muslce cars did 14's, maybe 13's from the factory, they weren't that fast. The fun of muscle cars was the same as today's cars, modding them. So really, today's SRT-4's, STi's, and Evo's are very much the same as muscle cars of the 70's. Cheap car + power + modability = muscle car.

You are completely right....I'm not talking about cars from the 70's. However I am imressed with a car that comes from the factory with a built bottom end and can with stand 700+ hp with out taking the valve covers off. To write off a whole countries car is just redicoulios. Hell british cars are notoriose for electrical problems but that doesn't make the elise less of a car. Thats just moronic.

Raven18940

04-20-2008, 06:25 PM

You are completely right....I'm not talking about cars from the 70's. However I am imressed with a car that comes from the factory with a built bottom end and can with stand 700+ hp with out taking the valve covers off. To write off a whole countries car is just redicoulios. Hell british cars are notoriose for electrical problems but that doesn't make the elise less of a car. Thats just moronic.
Exactly, this whole thing is silly, people get a bit too caught up in the names. Fast is fast. Anything that can hold 700hp is crazy, that's an awesome engine.

Vypurr

04-20-2008, 06:47 PM

I think what I find attractive about American Muscle is their ability to overbuild their cars. As PhillySVT said, building massive power on a stock motor is impressive. And it just seems more common to find awesome stock motors under the hood of American cars such as the 5.0, LS1, and LS2.

Not hating on imports...because I drive one... But they are more expensive normally for a less impressive base to build off of.

peteyturbo

04-20-2008, 11:17 PM

Wait, so you have a Turbo'd 03?? I thought it was still SC so yeah I'm down :)
LEt me know if you need help finding an evo. They are good no frills daily drivers, very reliable, 30mpg, and can easily run low 12's, very easily..What is your "area"?I agree.....They have a fast top speed but thay aren't too quick. I think the run the quarter in the low 11's. Now thro it on a track and it is gonna spanck most cars. I just offered the ride so you could see what a turbo V8 is like. Way funner than my old ported eaton set up. If you are ever in the area hit me up. Do you own a Evo now? I think I might dump my daily driver for a used Evo.

SpEcRv9

04-22-2008, 10:12 AM

i want shotgun!!! lol, phillysvt my buddy pete with a wrx (i think you're his boss) told me he rode in your car and its disgusting...you go to any meets?

PhillySVT

04-24-2008, 05:50 PM

i want shotgun!!! lol, phillysvt my buddy pete with a wrx (i think you're his boss) told me he rode in your car and its disgusting...you go to any meets?

yup...thats me. I'm on the main line.

SovXietday

04-25-2008, 11:50 AM

I think what I find attractive about American Muscle is their ability to overbuild their cars. As PhillySVT said, building massive power on a stock motor is impressive. And it just seems more common to find awesome stock motors under the hood of American cars such as the 5.0, LS1, and LS2.

And they respond to small mods scary well.

Now if only Chevy would back up their engines with a rear...

fsburnout216

04-28-2008, 08:42 PM

Cheap car + power + modability = muscle car.

i believe that 100% as long as you gain the power without throwing a turbo on your car. i believe the deffinition of muscle car is massive hp/torque in an all motor car.

building all motor is like lfting wieghts everyday and getting huge muscles. slapping on a turbo or using nitrous is like taking steriods. not saying i dont love the sound of a turbo spooling into a beautiful blow off. its just not muscle to me.

PhillySVT

04-28-2008, 10:17 PM

i believe that 100% as long as you gain the power without throwing a turbo on your car. i believe the deffinition of muscle car is massive hp/torque in an all motor car.

building all motor is like lfting wieghts everyday and getting huge muscles. slapping on a turbo or using nitrous is like taking steriods. not saying i dont love the sound of a turbo spooling into a beautiful blow off. its just not muscle to me.

Not muscle...what about a V8 turbo:lol: LOL....all my v8's will get a turbo after this car. Made it 10 times funner and I straight up rape cars from a roll. Not to shabby from a dig either except if they are putting down 500rwhp+ /500rwtq they will get the enitial jump but are being walked by by the top of 2nd to 3rd gear. You gotta love a fast all motor car but a ton of domestics are going FI.

tort9320g

04-29-2008, 06:57 AM

i believe that 100% as long as you gain the power without throwing a turbo on your car. i believe the deffinition of muscle car is massive hp/torque in an all motor car.

building all motor is like lfting wieghts everyday and getting huge muscles. slapping on a turbo or using nitrous is like taking steriods. not saying i dont love the sound of a turbo spooling into a beautiful blow off. its just not muscle to me.

And what about those among us that bought factory turbo cars ? I guess that immediately removes us from your list. Oh well, i'll stick with my measly .020" over 4 banger with a turbo the size of your head. By the way, the car put down 507/429 before being properly tuned last year...550ish after. That was the old set-up. Since then we've upgraded the turbo, cams, exhaust and intake manifolds. I understand what you're saying about doing it all on motor and that's all good and fine, but for the small cid guys we gotta make it any way we can.

Dave

fuzionauto

05-01-2008, 11:52 PM

SleeperGoat

05-02-2008, 02:03 AM

SleeperGoat

05-02-2008, 02:13 AM

Not muscle...what about a V8 turbo:lol: LOL....all my v8's will get a turbo after this car. Made it 10 times funner and I straight up rape cars from a roll. Not to shabby from a dig either except if they are putting down 500rwhp+ they will get the enitial jump but are being walked by by the top of 2nd to 3rd gear. You gotta love a fast all motor car but a ton of domestics are going FI.

That is true up to a few years ago most the Quick 8 cars were big motors with spray as of recently i've noticed most have changed over to Twin Turbo setups or single turbo setups.

I think the problem with american muscle is that fans of it put it on a pedestal that never existed. Most muslce cars did 14's, maybe 13's from the factory, they weren't that fast. The fun of muscle cars was the same as today's cars, modding them. So really, today's SRT-4's, STi's, and Evo's are very much the same as muscle cars of the 70's. Cheap car + power + modability = muscle car.

This is true as hell haha, my Car ran a whole 15.7 with a 305 an my brothers buddy's mustang was rocking mid 14's. The only thing is around that time it was quick to have a 11 second car.

BlkWhtTSI

05-02-2008, 07:53 AM

SleeperGoat

05-02-2008, 12:01 PM

I think he means you can pick them up used with low miles with out spending a fortune.

disturbedfan121

05-05-2008, 11:22 AM

if you wanna compare the displacement to HP numbers, rotory's are gonna win hands down, 1.3L making over 1000hp? on 0 pistons, so the v8's lose there too lol

pearl

05-05-2008, 11:27 AM

domestic beef > imported beef

PhillySVT

05-08-2008, 10:23 PM

While that's a fantastic story, I don't know you, and therefore, I don't buy it. I've seen too many people on the internet who are way too full of ****.

I just find it funny how reading comprehension pwns you. Apparently, you took me saying that I don't give a rats ass about domestics to mean that I am strictly a "Nissan guy". While it is true that I own a Nissan at the moment, that does not mean that I don't have respect for other makes or models. I love a 1200 HP Supra or an 1800 HP Viper as much as the next guy. That does not however mean that I'll be wasting my time signing up and hanging out on the ****ing Supra and Viper forums.

Now I'm done talking to you. Go talk to a bunch of your 900 hp friends up the street, or go hang on the GA, TX or FL forums for a bit.

kthxbye

saw these and thought of you.....enjoy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHTaCJyp7Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNSpp6fKnLk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NILYA-nWKrY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw_GoCtd5TU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8OIK_RSeyI
http://n2s1.net/RacingVideos/mofobucs/street-racers-gone-wild.wmv
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=janRhas3M8k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17NXbP8f2ks

Sick Supra for all you fans:
http://videos.topredline.com/recentvideos/1/215052a3-8700-403f-90b9-576933c026d0.htm
One of my favorites cas this Notch just plain moves:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uiFU2GcVfU

PS....11's on the street is considered "slow" in alot of areas.

SleeperGoat

05-09-2008, 02:25 AM

PS....11's on the street is considered "slow" in alot of areas.

Now a days it is with FI an Spray few years ago though it was a different story. Those videos are cool though reminds me of watching my buddys vette drive around. Nothing like crusing a 1100hp car like its a DD haha.

Mach1

05-10-2008, 11:17 AM

shoot, just 10yrs ago 12's was impressive, now if you not doing 11's go home.

SleeperGoat

05-10-2008, 01:25 PM

shoot, just 10yrs ago 12's was impressive, now if you not doing 11's go home.

10 years ago? i'd learn more towards 5ish

pearl

05-10-2008, 01:29 PM

i know a guy who runs 3's

PhillySVT

05-10-2008, 05:28 PM

i know a guy who runs 3's

in the 60 foot? LOL

HickRocket1258

05-11-2008, 01:57 PM

pearl

05-11-2008, 02:50 PM

in the 60 foot? LOL
he runs the mile in 3 seconds in his domestic he traps at 5150 mph

PhillySVT

05-12-2008, 05:22 PM

he runs the mile in 3 seconds in his domestic he traps at 5150 mph

:banana:

PhillySVT

05-12-2008, 05:28 PM

I have an '85 camaro that has a small block and I'm running 11.60s with stock suspension and complete exhaust with cat and muffler. Haven't really even tuned the carb either. **** I thought that was impressive but I guess it's not.

Thats a lot faster than most around here....most of those vids I posted are in Florida.....those guys have no state inspection and just get rediculoise with their street cars. Check out that last vid with the notch.....thats an 03 Hellion cobra he is racing.....probably a low 10 to mid 9 street car. He just blows him away at over 170.

pearl

05-12-2008, 05:46 PM

what about mid-high nine second hondas? thats more impressive to me... seems like more of a challenge getting a car with a smaller motor in it to run the same times.

HickRocket1258

05-12-2008, 06:44 PM

Yeah but then again you are talking about the whole apples and oranges thing. We are maybe doing it on motor, yet you are talking about a honda that probably needs a turbo to get into the 9s. So you are comparing the wrong thing. All motor cars are more impressive to me than a turbo car going 10s.

PhillySVT

05-12-2008, 07:15 PM

what about mid-high nine second hondas? thats more impressive to me... seems like more of a challenge getting a car with a smaller motor in it to run the same times.

I'm impressed by anything running in the 9's....Hell I was looking for a clean turbo hatch a year ago. Weight matters just as much as HP. I'm not hating on them at all.

SleeperGoat

05-13-2008, 02:07 AM

Thats a lot faster than most around here....most of those vids I posted are in Florida.....those guys have no state inspection and just get rediculoise with their street cars. Check out that last vid with the notch.....thats an 03 Hellion cobra he is racing.....probably a low 10 to mid 9 street car. He just blows him away at over 170.

My buddy Rob use to rock a sleeper Black notch like that, chevy motor with full exhaust extremely quiet, could sneak up on ya when your not looking. Pretty sure it was a low 10's car on motor an 9's on the juice. Were putting full exhaust on my camaro with the same mufflers aiming for the same effect just a bit higher octane.

HickRocket1258

05-13-2008, 08:44 AM

My buddy Rob use to rock a sleeper Black notch like that, chevy motor with full exhaust extremely quiet, could sneak up on ya when your not looking. Pretty sure it was a low 10's car on motor an 9's on the juice. Were putting full exhaust on my camaro with the same mufflers aiming for the same effect just a bit higher octane.
I like that. Something quiet for how fast it is. That is how my camaro is. It's only an 11 second car, but it is quieter than a lot of 12 second cars at the track. Still running on '93 as well. If I only got a good radiator for it, then it would be one good street sleeper.

SleeperGoat

05-13-2008, 12:56 PM

I like that. Something quiet for how fast it is. That is how my camaro is. It's only an 11 second car, but it is quieter than a lot of 12 second cars at the track. Still running on '93 as well. If I only got a good radiator for it, then it would be one good street sleeper.

Yeah after my 2nd motor i had to get a bigger Rad for the street to an some fans. So i got a AFCO 4" its huge wasnt that bad of a price either, just measuring it out was a pain.

HickRocket1258

05-13-2008, 01:37 PM

I still have the stock radiator, so obviously that's a piece. I have an electric fan and water pump that help out when I have to run back to back in the late rounds of racing. Where did you get the AFCO radiator from?

Mach1

05-13-2008, 04:02 PM

10 years ago? i'd learn more towards 5ish

not really, 5yrs ago stock LS1's and 03-04 Cobras were doing 12's, along with basic mod LT1's and 99-01 Cobras and Mach1's. Not to mention Vette's

SleeperGoat

05-14-2008, 02:04 AM

not really, 5yrs ago stock LS1's and 03-04 Cobras were doing 12's, along with basic mod LT1's and 99-01 Cobras and Mach1's. Not to mention Vette's

Yeah my bad i forget how much time has gone by :cry:

I still have the stock radiator, so obviously that's a piece. I have an electric fan and water pump that help out when I have to run back to back in the late rounds of racing. Where did you get the AFCO radiator from?

BP Speed when I use to go there all the time, Travis use to always help me out on prices cause it seemed like my car was always breaking down.

HickRocket1258

05-14-2008, 03:47 PM

SleeperGoat

05-15-2008, 01:59 AM

I think my buddy used to go there all the time with his lx mustang. I guess I will just have to look at Jegs or Summit for a radiator. The direct fit is real expensive and I know the universal ones I will need to tinker with for fitment issues.

Yeah i went with a universal we just measured the stock one which is funny cause it still didnt fit right we had to shave the flanges off both sides an lower the tray that the rad sits in. It now also sits slanted a bit an I gotta find some heavy duty dual fans which i think i might just steal out of a 00-02 LS1 F-Body.

HickRocket1258

05-15-2008, 02:18 PM

Yeah i went with a universal we just measured the stock one which is funny cause it still didnt fit right we had to shave the flanges off both sides an lower the tray that the rad sits in. It now also sits slanted a bit an I gotta find some heavy duty dual fans which i think i might just steal out of a 00-02 LS1 F-Body.

Haha that's great to hear that even after all the modifications that it still doesn't fit in there quite right. Oh well. Thanks for the help. When is your camaro going to be done?

SleeperGoat

05-16-2008, 03:02 AM

Haha that's great to hear that even after all the modifications that it still doesn't fit in there quite right. Oh well. Thanks for the help. When is your camaro going to be done?

Hoping July, I'm placing a big order with Spohn this weekend but i gotta make sure they'll let me pick it all up cause im not paying for that shippin lol. The Rad was totally worth it though i saw a huge change in cooling it was nuts. Even with no shroud an a single electric mustang fan the car would just drop in temp when i turned it on.

ICE95Z

05-16-2008, 06:56 PM

Apples and oranges my friends, apples and oranges.

HickRocket1258

05-16-2008, 08:28 PM

Hoping July, I'm placing a big order with Spohn this weekend but i gotta make sure they'll let me pick it all up cause im not paying for that shippin lol. The Rad was totally worth it though i saw a huge change in cooling it was nuts. Even with no shroud an a single electric mustang fan the car would just drop in temp when i turned it on.

I guess I will have to look into it then. You doing any certain races with it, or more just a car to screw around with?

SleeperGoat

05-16-2008, 10:15 PM

I guess I will have to look into it then. You doing any certain races with it, or more just a car to screw around with?

Will probably just detune it *sandbag* an run 10.0 index so were not beating the balls out of it all the time. Gonna take awhile to figure out how to keep it from breaking out alot anyway. The car was suppose to be a 383 with some laughing gas so i could cruise it around town an actually get some kind of gas milage an run 93. Sadly i dont think i'll make it to any "get togethers" farther then 100 miles with out bringin spare fuel which is what i wanted to build the car for hehe. Besides that it will probably just be a town cruiser to shut up people who use to talk to much.:lol:

dragonfly2k3

05-16-2008, 11:49 PM

if you wanna compare the displacement to HP numbers, rotory's are gonna win hands down, 1.3L making over 1000hp? on 0 pistons, so the v8's lose there too lol

that is not really an accurate statement. While the displacement is 1.3l it is more comparable to a 2.6l reciprocating engine because the rotary uses all of its potential displacement to make power in one revolution compared to a recip which only uses half of its potential displacement to make power per revolution. So while the rotary only contains 1.3l of displacement it also fires 1.3l of displacement in one revolution as to where a reciprocating engine with displacement of 2.6l only fires 1.3l of displacement per 1 revolution. Now look at a skyline making 1000hp, not so out of the ordinary, and I bet the skyline burns less fuel to do it.

HickRocket1258

05-18-2008, 08:39 AM

Will probably just detune it *sandbag* an run 10.0 index so were not beating the balls out of it all the time. Gonna take awhile to figure out how to keep it from breaking out alot anyway. The car was suppose to be a 383 with some laughing gas so i could cruise it around town an actually get some kind of gas milage an run 93. Sadly i dont think i'll make it to any "get togethers" farther then 100 miles with out bringin spare fuel which is what i wanted to build the car for hehe. Besides that it will probably just be a town cruiser to shut up people who use to talk to much.:lol:

That is nice. I always thought about trying to do the 12.0 index when my car was slower. Plus those races are kind of hard for me to get to nowadays. I would really like to shut up some people around my area with my car, especially some of the kids with their evos and ****. It's just with the stock radiator I can't get very far without having to shut it down and let the pump and fan cool it down. It is nice to run on '93 since it is still somewhat cheap for now haha.

SleeperGoat

05-18-2008, 12:13 PM

That is nice. I always thought about trying to do the 12.0 index when my car was slower. Plus those races are kind of hard for me to get to nowadays. I would really like to shut up some people around my area with my car, especially some of the kids with their evos and ****. It's just with the stock radiator I can't get very far without having to shut it down and let the pump and fan cool it down. It is nice to run on '93 since it is still somewhat cheap for now haha.

Yup, you know you could always go to a junk yard an see if the LS1 Rad an Fan swap will work for ya. My buddys running a 355 with a Supercharger in his 92 Z28 with no heating problems with that change.

HickRocket1258

05-18-2008, 05:21 PM

SleeperGoat

05-18-2008, 06:01 PM

That is interesting. Maple Grove has that new index thing this year. Maybe I will see you and your ride there. I just do all the bracket racing events at Maple Grove pretty much. You think you'll be done your ride by Super Chevy at Maple Grove? That is a fun event. It is July 17-20.

Were gonna try, I doubt i'll be able to legally be aloud to run cause the cage wont get into the car till august. If i did anything i'd probably just half track alot an not launch it, i dont feel like having the back window break from twisting. Will see though depends on shop time an such.

devildog214

01-27-2010, 09:51 PM

yeah american muscle has always been a little behind on technology, my 87 still has a goddamn carburetor. Gm's genIII smallblock LS series still isnt going modular like ford, single cam with pushrods, atleast the new ss camaro (auto) will have VVT and ls's use aluminum blocks and heads for the mostpart along with coil-on-plug ignition. If were talking about the v8 techonogy war fords leading, im kinda psyched about a mustang for the first time with this new modular 5.0 making decent numbers, and with their mustangs light weight you know gm's gonna push for a z28. But maybe older is better for modification and maitence, swapping 1 cam instead of 2 or 4...idk.