megasquirt anyone?

[GmFwd]

Is anyone currently running a Megasquirt car?

Ill be doing a piggyback setup on my 1994 z26. Ill be controling spark and fuel only. (maybe IAC, not sure yet).

Anyone have expereince tuning using megatune?

[Instigator1225]

yes sir... ive done 2 rx7s (including one p port) ...and i am currently doing a EFI 66 vw beetle....what u need to know?

[GmFwd]

Thats good to hear. I dont know of anyone using it, so ill post any questions I have about tuning on here.

Are you running the LC1 wideband?

[iloveturbolag]

i know of a guy who uses it on his FC Rx7 with a 1JZ in it.
apperently he hasn't gotten it to run yet tho....... not saying its the megasquirts fault, just throwing it in there.

[ImportDPS]

The megasquirt is a real popular system on the Nissan rides....

[bigbrakeparts]

One of our good friends who helps us our with our cars, Gavin, is an expert at Megasquirt. He has Megasquirted a 78 280z, 83 280z, 91 corolla wagon 20v, miata turbo, mini cooper with honda b16 turbo, etc. It is an incredibly powerful system that will allow you to do just about anything with your z26. Also, it really teaches quite a bit about how your car really works.

I have found megatune to be as intuitive as any other tuning software -- they all seem to have their pros and cons.

If you have any questions you can reach Gavin at gavin@bigbrakeparts.net

Good luck

[TROLL]

SoStock92 is running one still I believe... he knows a LOT about it... and also turbo miata dude, his name is slipping my mind right now.

[BradC]

SoStock92 is running one still I believe... he knows a LOT about it... and also turbo miata dude, his name is slipping my mind right now.

cardriverx

I'll be running one soon, gotta build it though first, lol.

[Cardriverx]

woho I was rembered haha.

Yeah ive been running megasquirt for a year now, I know my way around it well. Megatune is real easy to learn, good program. If you have any qs ask away!

Im also running the LC1, it was real easy to interface with the MS


I suggest going to miataturbo.net, we have a huge megasquirt info base, most of it not just miata related.

[toplessFC3Sman]

A bit late to the party, but i've been running MS for a year and a half on my '7, and have set up a running system on a CBR600F4i, both of the installs for fuel and spark. I've also used an LC-1 on both installs, and they are great little units regardless of price

[GmFwd]

Sounds good.

Im using msI with msextra for spark control.

Im making the wiring harness for it now.

[lagos]

I've been thinking about setting up MS on my own car for a while now, however there are some hurdles to overcome with getting MS to talk to my ignition system.

[Chefsp0t]

I am using a Spectre EMS Pro unit with an Innovate LC1 wideband in my Mx6. It is an MS1 based board.

http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/spectre-emspro-engine-management-system-p-157.html

Does anyone know a good megasquirt tuner in the Pottstown/limerick area? I would love to have someone tune it that knows the system well.

[Raven18940]

I wish I could run Megasquirt, damn OBDII laws.

[Chefsp0t]

Has anyone taken their car to r/t tuning in lansdale? They seem to be very expensive.

[Xuracing]

MS is also popular in the bmw crowd. There is a self tune feature with the lc-1.

[Chefsp0t]

How does the self tune feature work? I haven't figured everything out yet.

[Xuracing]

using the analog outputs on the lc1 it plugs into the ms. You get a very very basic map. you drive the car. Pretty much all you have to do is put in the simple values like, displacement, redline, and desired afr iirc and you drive the car it will lean the car out, every now and then you need to smooth out the power curve, on the fuel map then keep on going, and every not and then you need to burn the old data so you get a better tune. Its pretty simple and straight forward.

Not as good as dyno tunning but will definitely get you on the road safely and put down 90% of the power

[Chefsp0t]

I personally like the VE analyzer feature in megalogviewer. The results are not instant like autotune but it does the same thing, right?

[JSpecV03]

Has anyone taken their car to r/t tuning in lansdale? They seem to be very expensive.

yeah, but i dont have a problem knowing that every penny was well spent and the car in excelant hands. these guys are pros and i wouldnt go anywhere else.

The megasquirt is a real popular system on the Nissan rides....

alot of the b15 sentra guys that are boosted love the megasquirt.

[Chefsp0t]

Thanks for the reply. I will definitely check them out in the spring after I have a few more engine parts installed. No sense in tuning it twice.

[lagos]

^ Lol at you thinking tuning is a one time deal.
It can sometimes take a few months to properly tune the car from the ground up on a full ems. This is not a WOT map reflash like the subaru or evo guys do.

[Chefsp0t]

:roll: I know that, I've had MS on my car for almost a year now. Tuning is an ongoing process but it helps to take it to the best guys around if you want it done right. I'd rather not pay someone else 3 times for something a better shop can do in one day.

[disturbedfan121]

i run a megasquirt and an LC-1 wideband. i use it for spark, fuel, timing, launch control, flat foot shifting, pretty much everything lol

and i self tune mine, even when i get dyno time i'll tune it myself.

[Cardriverx]

Does anyone know a good megasquirt tuner in the Pottstown/limerick area? I would love to have someone tune it that knows the system well.

I would love to help you out man, but im in pittsburgh right now. And take everyones advice, tuning the car is a long term process. I have been tweaking my fuel and spark maps for the last like year lol. It would probably be less work if I just used the open loop mode, but id rather have the car read off the map the whole time, just in case the lc-1 decides not to work one day.

The VE analyzer is great, just only use it for fuel, and make sure your datalog is AT LEAST 20 min long and is very varied driving wise. The spark map you really should tune your self, messing it up under high load situations can cause horrible detonation.

You dont really need to pay some one to tune it, just get a dyno for a hour and read up on tuning. With just street tuning you can still get the car very close to perfect tho, it just takes some time.


lagos- just use a friggin trigger wheel bolted to the crank, and get MS already. :)

[lagos]

lagos- just use a friggin trigger wheel bolted to the crank, and get MS already

See thats the thing, I don't think I want to go with the trigger wheel and ford EDIS. At least not right away.

I got in touch with an mr2 guy who owns a scope, and we actually figured out what the problem is with the distributor. The 3sgte distributor actually has 3 vr sensors that that share the same ground. Megasquirt only needs one, however since they all share a ground, the other two cause a lot of noise that disrupts the signal. So what you have to do is to disassemble the distributor, remove the other 2 sensors and grind off a few teeth. I'm going to wait until his project is up and running in his car before I start down this path, that way I'll have someone to turn to for help.
Here is a video of the jig he set up with this scope showing the signal after removing the other two vr sensors.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMKoU9JEgVA
Also MS3 (currently in development) is said to add support for my distributor by adding a few vr conditioning sensors to deal with the problem.

I also have a few questions for you MS users.
Is it really worth getting ms2 over ms1? The mr2 guy I've been talking to prefers ms1 because he claims that there is a lot more support for it.

What about knock sensor input? I understand that MS on its own is not able to log a knock count or pull timing in the event of detonation.

Right now I'm working on rewiring a harness for a friends 3sgte swap. So thats been taking up most of my geek time. However once I'm finished with that, I'll probably order an ms2 kit.

[Chefsp0t]

I would love to help you out man, but im in pittsburgh right now. And take everyones advice, tuning the car is a long term process. I have been tweaking my fuel and spark maps for the last like year lol. It would probably be less work if I just used the open loop mode, but id rather have the car read off the map the whole time, just in case the lc-1 decides not to work one day.

The VE analyzer is great, just only use it for fuel, and make sure your datalog is AT LEAST 20 min long and is very varied driving wise. The spark map you really should tune your self, messing it up under high load situations can cause horrible detonation.

You dont really need to pay some one to tune it, just get a dyno for a hour and read up on tuning. With just street tuning you can still get the car very close to perfect tho, it just takes some time.

I am not really in a hurry. The car doesn't get driven much in the winter anyway. My cranking fuel is all out of whack at low temperatures. Would you be interested in helping me in the spring?

I have been street tuning it since I got the car back. It runs pretty well for the most part. It just needs a tuner's touch. Some time on the dyno would definitely give me more power and a smoother running car. I datalog every day during the nicer seasons when I drive it to work and back. It's about a 25 minute drive. I have thought about running the car in open loop but I haven't tried it yet. I am comfortable making changes on the fuel map but I don't know enough about timing to make any changes in the spark map. I am learning as I go.

The main thing I tune myself is the idle. I have a heavily modified motor that nobody else in the MX6/Probe world has done so I am kind of on my own as far as fuel/spark maps and tuning. The larger cams and low compression pistons make for a pretty high (900-1200 rpm) and rough idle. I've got it idling pretty steady between 14-15 afr but if I turn on any accessories (windshield wipers, climate control fans, headlights, etc.) or turn the steering wheel the rpms drop off significantly and sometimes it stalls. Do you have any suggestions for fixing this?

Thanks
Chris

[lagos]

try adding timing at idle.

[Cardriverx]

also 14-15 afr at idle is way lean, adding some fuel should help smooth it out too.

As for the timing map, you want it to be around 40 degrees in cruise, as much timing as you can add at full power without knock, and you should be somewhere between 15 and 30 degrees at idle depending on what you car likes.


lagos, the ms2 will have some more support in the future, and supposedly the open loop boost control actually works on ms2 where as the code for ms1 ****s up the open loop boost control. That and all the tables are 12x12 on ms2, where as only the fuel and spark are on ms1. is it worth it? dunno... id prolly go ms1.


btw here is my older spark map, just so you can get a general idea chef. Ive reciently added like 5 more degrees after 1800 rpm and below 100 kpa. I read some articles saying best fuel efficenty is around 45 degrees of timing.

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g42/cardriverx/spark_map.jpg?t=1232333086

[tredvento]

im getting ready to swap a 16v/aba in a mk3 vw jetta im gonna run it on itb's with megasquirt

[lagos]

Cardriverx, so are you on ms1 or ms2? PCB3 ?

Btw, 14-15afr is where you should idle. Thats the stoich a/f ratio that o2 sensors try to put the car in during cruising and idleing. The only time you would want it richer would be at cold start up.

[Cardriverx]

Cardriverx, so are you on ms1 or ms2? PCB3 ?

Btw, 14-15afr is where you should idle. Thats the stoich a/f ratio that o2 sensors try to put the car in during cruising and idleing. The only time you would want it richer would be at cold start up.

im saying that on cars that are cammed, or really anything else that can effect idle, richening up the car at idle will help smooth it out. My car likes to be around 13.5 at idle. Over 14.5 to 15 it starts to studder a little.

Duringing cruise, I try to hit 15.5-16 ish afr, save a little gas and as long as the EGTs are not way high, your fine.

MS1 V3.0 from diyautotune.com

[lagos]

So why did you decide on ms1 v3? The price difference between v3 and ms2v3 is only a few bucks, why didnt you go for ms2?

[Cardriverx]

So why did you decide on ms1 v3? The price difference between v3 and ms2v3 is only a few bucks, why didnt you go for ms2?

not enough support, the MS1 into the early miatas is very well documented, and guaranteed to work. check out the site in my sig, I have a whole MS section in it.

[digdug18]

I wish I could run Megasquirt, damn OBDII laws.

There's other systems you could run other then megasquirt. I'm in newtown as well, you can get away with alot providing you do it correctly.

[GmFwd]

Im running MSI extra. Doing full feil and spark control.

Right now im working on using a PWM idle valve to keep my idle good.

[disturbedfan121]

i know someone running a MS in parallel on their 04 MSM and they passed inspection.

[whiteturbo]

ughhh.. i wanna try running MS, i just am having the most difficult time understanding it all... I read the FAQ's and started looking on the websites but for some reason i just can't get a great grasp of it.

[GmFwd]

Any specific questions? Its kinda overwhelming at first, but its pretty simple.

[whiteturbo]

Without trying to write a book.. basically i wanna turbo my N/A Subaru, this seems like the best bang for the buck for engine management, but to the best of my knowledge there's only 2 people to actually get it to work on Subaru's. I started reading the FAQ's and whatnot but the different versions and all this are totally making my brain spin! I guess what do you suggest i read to try and pick up this whole concept? Should i just read everything i possibly can about MS?? thanks

[GmFwd]

Actually, stop reading. It may just be confusing you more.

Its so simple when you break it all down.

You need a few inputs. Coolant temp, intake air temp, map sensor(built in to ms), Oxygen sensor(narrow or wideband), and a tach signal. Some of those are optional but all are reccomended. Also a tps is good too, but not needed.

Then just tie in your injectors. Thats all easy. 2 injectors to each driver.

The part that varies from car to car is the ignition. You have to research how to do suby ignition with MS. HOWEVER, you dont have to use suby ignition any more if you dont want to. With MS you can pretty much use whatever you want component wise. The ford dis system has a TON of support.

Your stock computer will probably work to keep the idle in check. If not thats not hard to work around either.

All of that can be done with MS1 with the extra code put on it.

[piku]

How does megasquirt piggyback? Doesn't the stock computer get upset that half it's sensors are missing?

[GmFwd]

You can keep the stock computer getting all its inputs. Alot of the sensors signals can be split. Map is on board, so your stock map still goes to the stock ecu. Tps can be split, coolant temp and air intake temp cannot be split. So you would have to put in 2 extra sensors.

If you get it tuned well, you can get it to run with no check engine light. It "may" even pass a obd2 emission test if your 96 and up.

For 95 and below cars its easy to pass emissions.

[John@20squared]

im getting ready to swap a 16v/aba in a mk3 vw jetta im gonna run it on itb's with megasquirt
Let me know if you're looking for a semi- "plug-n-play" MS setup.

[piku]

You can keep the stock computer getting all its inputs. Alot of the sensors signals can be split. Map is on board, so your stock map still goes to the stock ecu. Tps can be split, coolant temp and air intake temp cannot be split. So you would have to put in 2 extra sensors.

If you get it tuned well, you can get it to run with no check engine light. It "may" even pass a obd2 emission test if your 96 and up.

For 95 and below cars its easy to pass emissions.

It honestly sounds like piggybacking might be just the trick for turbocharging my M3 but still passing OBDII emissions. And it fits right along my particular hankering to do absolutely everything myself. I mean I'm a linux/win mobile embedded device programmer. Tuning and megasquirt is something I was born to do.

I was originally going to get the special cable I need to download my flash and try to modify maps that way, but you'd have to change injector sizes and there'd be an awful lot of guessing going on (and maybe blown $6000 engines :-/) I'm not an expert disassembler by any sense of the word. But a well documented open system. That's my cup of tea.

[Xuracing]

Yeah... i don't think you will be able to run ms piggy back and still pass obd2 emissions there are too many sensors. unless you are planning on keeping that in, and running separate sensors for the ms.

And even if you do that. Your obd2 system will be throwing codes like crazy

but hollar for another e36 m3 here!

[Cardriverx]

Yeah... i don't think you will be able to run ms piggy back and still pass obd2 emissions there are too many sensors. unless you are planning on keeping that in, and running separate sensors for the ms.

And even if you do that. Your obd2 system will be throwing codes like crazy

but hollar for another e36 m3 here!

Hey whats up man, dident know you were on here. Any updates about the car/shop?

[piku]

Yeah... i don't think you will be able to run ms piggy back and still pass obd2 emissions there are too many sensors. unless you are planning on keeping that in, and running separate sensors for the ms.

And even if you do that. Your obd2 system will be throwing codes like crazy

but hollar for another e36 m3 here!

I think if anyone knew what the M3 could do or thought of the economics of owning one like I do, everyone would have one ;)

Oh well, I guess I'll have to go back to my original idea. I want a fully street legal (at least apparently) turbo car.

[GmFwd]

Yeah... i don't think you will be able to run ms piggy back and still pass obd2 emissions there are too many sensors. unless you are planning on keeping that in, and running separate sensors for the ms.

And even if you do that. Your obd2 system will be throwing codes like crazy

but hollar for another e36 m3 here!

PLease explain more specificly? WHat extra sensors are there? Pre and post cat o2 sensors, They stay right where they are. MAF, ms dosent need it, but can use it. Its a map based system, very good for accurate boost tunes. Any other sensors like cam sensors and crank sensors are just for igniton and stuff.

It will NOT throw codes if the ms is tuned good, and all inputs to the stock computer are within specs.

So really you could split the tps signal, install a ms specific coolant temp sensor(just a hole and tap), and a air intake temp sensor(you need a thread in one for boost anyway), and you "could" split the o2 sensor too, but a wideband is needed to tune to perfection.

Does your motor have anything special with the valves like vtec or variable valve timing? That gets a little complicated...

But if not, all these motors are the same really. A few inputs and outputs and its running. Once you install ms you will see how much factory crap you DONT need.:mrgreen:

[piku]

PLease explain more specificly? WHat extra sensors are there? Pre and post cat o2 sensors, They stay right where they are. MAF, ms dosent need it, but can use it. Its a map based system, very good for accurate boost tunes. Any other sensors like cam sensors and crank sensors are just for igniton and stuff.

It will NOT throw codes if the ms is tuned good, and all inputs to the stock computer are within specs.

So really you could split the tps signal, install a ms specific coolant temp sensor(just a hole and tap), and a air intake temp sensor(you need a thread in one for boost anyway), and you "could" split the o2 sensor too, but a wideband is needed to tune to perfection.

Does your motor have anything special with the valves like vtec or variable valve timing? That gets a little complicated...

But if not, all these motors are the same really. A few inputs and outputs and its running. Once you install ms you will see how much factory crap you DONT need.:mrgreen:

Single VANOS but that's about it. It's like a 2 or 3 position solenoid that controls intake cam position relative to crank and exhaust cam relative to engine load and speed. In reality though it just opens the intake valves a bit sooner above 3000 something RPM. You could probably easily code manual control of it.

Aside from the VANOS it's just a typical MAF OBDII motor with 2 o2 sensors, 2 monitoring o2 sensors, 6 distinct ignition coils and ... traction control. It'd be nice to not lose that.

[GmFwd]

If it is just a solinoid then I beleive you can control that with MS. I know you can do vtec with it so that should be similar. It will take some research, but you can figure it out. Theres enough outputs you could use to make it happen

Traction control may still work, but if not, MSI extra has some type of traction control built in. It compares wheel speed with either another wheel(front in your case), or vss to another wheel(non drive wheel) are retards timing accordingly. Pretty easy to do if you have abs.

[GmFwd]

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/BMW_E30_Megasquirt_&_Wasted_Spark_ECU_Convertion
Some of that may apply to you. Maybe not though. I have very little knowlege of bmw's.

The biggest part is finding out how to make your ignition work if possible. Its cake after that.

[piku]

I'm not really scared of the ignition at all. From a technical standpoint wiring everything up is a simple (and tedious) matter of electronics and specifications. It's the tables and messing up the tuning that puts me off.

[GmFwd]

Is your stock ecm tunable? Because that is always your best option.

I chose MS because I cant tune my stock ecm and it was only 150 bucks.

[piku]

I can, I am almost sure I can extract the flash image from the ecu with a $55 adapter cable and flash it back on. The problem is nobody published table locations, sizes, etc because everyone wants to make money off their findings. Luckily I'm pretty good at reverse engineering things like that. I just wish my engine wasn't on the line for testing results though. Without a wideband o2 sensor all I'll really be able to do is guess, but it would be sweet to be able to tweak the factory tune vs coming up with it myself.