Honda Help. Turbo or NA

[JDMTyler3326]

So I know there is tons of honda heads on here and I need help with my build. Im not sure if I wanna turbo my B16 or keep it NA. As is right now I beat stage 2 srt4s, k20s...

JDM B16b on b16 trans
-auto zone Intake
-Buddy Club Header
-Buddy Club 2.5 Exhaust
-Type R cams
-Chipped and Tuned p28.

Vtec at 4800 and redline at 9400.

Tons of people are telling me to booast my car and it will be a beast motor.

I heard b16s and Type R cams on boost are known to blow up and I dont wanna do that.

I can change out the pistons and get a better fuel rail, injectors, and Hondata and run a small turbo at 9psi and be close to 300wph.

Or I was thinking about doing
All motor with
-Buddy Club Header
-Buddy Club 2.5 Exhaust
-Type R cams
-Type R Inake Mani
-3 Inch AEM Intake
-TB (Not sure of what kind yet)
-Hondata s200
-Port and Polish Head
-Injectors (not sure what size)

I also want to change out my b16 5th gear with a LS 5th gear.

And have a all motor beast close to 205whp. I am going towards all motor more cause I don't wanna risk blowing my motor up with a turbo.

[lownslow95]

I'd do an all motor build.

[jpalamar]

It will get stolen so it doesn't really matter what you do.

[mcperson2k]

Aren't 'stage 2' srt4's running like 13.6-13.8 1/4 mile times? How are you beating them?

[OutToWinPAHC]

I hate the term stages and blowing up because of cams..... I dont see that. Different cams for NA and boost when coming to splits and overlap so they may not be the best for boost but at the end of the day they were safe enough to be a factory cam. Blowing up motors comes to a few things, unhealthy motor, oiling issues, cooling issues, and a bad tune/timing. So if your compression numbers are good and you plan on boost you should do a few things oil pump water pump timing set, head resurfaced and use a quality MLS gasket, ARP head studs. Proper research for oil feed and drain, and a quality tune for the set up. Taking factory NA motors and just slapping cheap turbo kits on them is not the way to go if you want it to last

[JDMTyler3326]

It will get stolen so it doesn't really matter what you do.Hater

Aren't 'stage 2' srt4's running like 13.6-13.8 1/4 mile times? How are you beating them?
Ran two from digs last night and i get them about 1.5 cars. Im gutted out with no PS and AC
I hate the term stages and blowing up because of cams..... I dont see that. Different cams for NA and boost when coming to splits and overlap so they may not be the best for boost but at the end of the day they were safe enough to be a factory cam. Blowing up motors comes to a few things, unhealthy motor, oiling issues, cooling issues, and a bad tune/timing. So if your compression numbers are good and you plan on boost you should do a few things oil pump water pump timing set, head resurfaced and use a quality MLS gasket, ARP head studs. Proper research for oil feed and drain, and a quality tune for the set up. Taking factory NA motors and just slapping cheap turbo kits on them is not the way to go if you want it to last
I am gonna do more research on it.

[underpressure02]

I have a hard time believing you are beating stage 2 srts and k20 motors with your current setup but if you say so.

Type r cams won't blow your motor they are actually pretty good for turbo cars. Just because you run all motor cams on a turbo setup isn't going to blow your motor. I made more power with skunk 2 pro 2 all motor cams then I did with the pro 2 turbo cams on my car. Just make sure you degree the cams in and get the car tuned.

[Scapegoat]

Aren't 'stage 2' srt4's running like 13.6-13.8 1/4 mile times? How are you beating them?

there were a handful of stock srt's back in the day pulling those numbers. i doubt this guy is beating stage 2 srt4s when he WANTS to have a "beast" that puts down 205whp.

[Dominick]

I'd do an all motor build.

x2

I have a hard time believing you are beating stage 2 srts and k20 motors with your current setup but if you say so.

Type r cams won't blow your motor they are actually pretty good for turbo cars. Just because you run all motor cams on a turbo setup isn't going to blow your motor. I made more power with skunk 2 pro 2 all motor cams then I did with the pro 2 turbo cams on my car. Just make sure you degree the cams in and get the car tuned.

With the EK hatchs being as light as they are, and his VTEC engaging at 4800, I can certainly see him pulling on K20s and some SRT4's.

JDMTyler, I would go the Buddy Club N/A motor route you had listed. EVERYONE turbos Honda's. It's getting to monotonus. It takes more ability to build a N/A motor and have it beat boosted cars.

I'd get some 700ish injectors and maybe a ITR throttle body to add to your list.

[grimm]

i would sell the b16 and buy a d series and turbo that. i imagine you'll be able to get more power from a turbo d then a mild build of a b. plus you might even have some cash leftover in the end. ohh and when the d series pops you can more easily afford a new one in comparison to the b.

[underpressure02]

x2



With the EK hatchs being as light as they are, and his VTEC engaging at 4800, I can certainly see him pulling on K20s and some SRT4's.

JDMTyler, I would go the Buddy Club N/A motor route you had listed. EVERYONE turbos Honda's. It's getting to monotonus. It takes more ability to build a N/A motor and have it beat boosted cars.

I'd get some 700ish injectors and maybe a ITR throttle body to add to your list.

EK hatches aren't light. I have an all motor ek hatch With most of the bs removed and it still weighs 2550 with a half tank of gas. Also he said beating srt's and k20 not pulling on them.

205 HP isn't a monster NA motor that is hardly anything.

[92accordex]

ugh. you bought such a correctly built car. Why mess it up? Chances are (speaking from past experience) youll mess with motor, not be able to fix it, then sell for a loss. As much as I wouldnt mind that, because Id take this car off your hands:) It's not a good idea. Leave it as is.Maybe do some minor boltons you or a friend could handle. But "building" a motor or boosting it isn't a walk in the park. You know im here for help always man. Just some c&c

[jpalamar]

Hater

I'm not a hater... I'm just smarter then you.

ugh. you bought such a correctly built car. Why mess it up? Chances are (speaking from past experience) youll mess with motor, not be able to fix it, then sell for a loss. As much as I wouldnt mind that, because Id take this car off your hands:) It's not a good idea. Leave it as is.Maybe do some minor boltons you or a friend could handle. But "building" a motor or boosting it isn't a walk in the park. You know im here for help always man. Just some c&c

This is exactly what I was thinking.

[cvcrcr99]

I can change out the pistons and get a better fuel rail, injectors, and Hondata and run a small turbo at 9psi and be close to 300wph.

Or I was thinking about doing
All motor with
-Buddy Club Header
-Buddy Club 2.5 Exhaust
-Type R cams
-Type R Inake Mani
-3 Inch AEM Intake
-TB (Not sure of what kind yet)
-Hondata s200
-Port and Polish Head
-Injectors (not sure what size)

Isn't a B16b that the Civic Type R motor? How would adding Type R cams and etc to it help?

If you are staying N/A Fuel rail would be overkill IMO. Hondata S200 is outdated. Just go for the S300. If you are staying N/A, I am sure 440cc injectors will be plenty unless you plan on running E85. That's about all of the constructive criticism I can provide without getting too involved in this thread. PM me if you have any specific questions.

[saxon]

I wouldn't do anything, it seems like you don't know a damn thing saying you added type r cams on a motor that already has them

turbo it with a legit (full race, synapse etc) and get a good tune, will be 300+ hp easy

[Big_Jim]

Hater
I'm not a hater... I'm just smarter then you.

New line for the sig. hahahaha

[russiankid]

Don't mess with it, you don't need to be the fastest kid around. You can make it go 11's on all motor, had a buddy who did with a B16.

[SovXietday]

With the EK hatchs being as light as they are, and his VTEC engaging at 4800, I can certainly see him pulling on K20s and some SRT4's.

JDMTyler, I would go the Buddy Club N/A motor route you had listed. EVERYONE turbos Honda's. It's getting to monotonus. It takes more ability to build a N/A motor and have it beat boosted cars.

I'd get some 700ish injectors and maybe a ITR throttle body to add to your list.

Stop. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about.

OP, I don't think you know what it takes to do either build, so I would just leave it the way it is. Your mod list is... all over the place. You've addressed all the wrong areas, under addressed some of the most crucial, and completely missed the rest.

[Got Insulin?]

Stop. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about.

OP, I don't think you know what it takes to do either build, so I would just leave it the way it is. Your mod list is... all over the place. You've addressed all the wrong areas, under addressed some of the most crucial, and completely missed the rest.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n116/tjedi1/bingo.gif

[Dominick]

Stop. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about.

OP, I don't think you know what it takes to do either build, so I would just leave it the way it is. Your mod list is... all over the place. You've addressed all the wrong areas, under addressed some of the most crucial, and completely missed the rest.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n116/tjedi1/bingo.gif

**** me right? :mad:

[94integra]

I know 3 people with allmotor civics,and they all tell me the same thing. B20V is the way to go,theres 2 street driven civics running really low 11s in town. They pull on modded evos from a dig,ive seen it. And whoever is driving the srt4 you raced cant drive for ish lol

[OutToWinPAHC]

cylinder head flow rates at said RPM, cam profile, displacement, fuel type its as much as you can really do NA

[DPancoast]

Build all motor.

[redtoprps13]

go boost... all motor is such a waste.... with boost you can have an interior as well and still be fast lol.... I have all motor now and hate it. i need boost again. and how would cams blow your motor? the worst that happens with too much overlap is that you're loosing boost through the head.

x2



It takes more ability to build a N/A motor and have it beat boosted cars.



it doesn't take much ability to make 215whp with a b/h/k/f series all motor anymore and strip your car down to near 2,000 lbs or less and run a close ratio trans. not to mention more often than not these turbo cars aren't even equally modded and still have full interiors. if you ask me it takes more ability to make big power with fwd and actually put it to the ground.

[AutobahnRacer]

All motor is in my opinion more respectable than boost.

[redtoprps13]

All motor is in my opinion more respectable than boost.

why? you guys make all motor out to be like it's hard where as boost is "easy"

[jpalamar]

why? you guys make all motor out to be like it's hard where as boost is "easy"

Boost is easy.

[redtoprps13]

Boost is easy.

the people saying turboing is easy. have you guys ever built a turbo setup or seen what goes into a proper one. it's not just a slap it on and go kind of thing.

[ivory rx8]

there were a handful of stock srt's back in the day pulling those numbers. i doubt this guy is beating stage 2 srt4s when he WANTS to have a "beast" that puts down 205whp.

Ur just a hater. I pull stage 2,3, and sometimes even stage 4 srt's all day in my intake and honDATA tuned civic si.

the people saying turboing is easy. have you guys ever built a turbo setup or seen what goes into a proper one. it's not just a slap it on and go kind of thing.

Duh it's easy on a civic. The vTack can handle like 20-25 pounds stock, so that's easily 400whp. U get way more street cred for fully bolting your k/b/c/l/d/r series Honda

[redtoprps13]

Ur just a hater. I pull stage 2,3, and sometimes even stage 4 srt's all day in my intake and honDATA tuned civic si.



Duh it's easy on a civic. The vTack can handle like 20-25 pounds stock, so that's easily 400whp. U get way more street cred for fully bolting your k/b/c/l/d/r series Honda

:cyberguy: lol i actually hear people talk like this....... i just say for the amount of money spent on some of these cars... you could have an s2k be rwd and faster lol

[DPancoast]

While I agree with boost not being "easy". Unfortunately there are more people than not slapping eBay kits on Hondas and doing great lol

[redtoprps13]

While I agree with boost not being "easy". Unfortunately there are more people than not slapping eBay kits on Hondas and doing great lol
lol true there are people who turbo just to say they have one and people who do it with a purpose. that goes for n/a as well. one could argue N/A is easy. all the tried and true methods have already been found. i/h/e/cams, valvetrain, IM/TB/higher compression stock pistons/injectors/fuel pump and tune that should get you past the 200whp mark... there you go... oh wait you have to do the same thing to turbo cars to build them properly plus add all of the turbo parts and get it all to work together. IMO opinion neither one is "easier" than the other.

[SHOdude]

And have a all motor beast close to 205whp.

Isn't that an oxymoron..?

[Rado_VR6]

Aren't 'stage 2' srt4's running like 13.6-13.8 1/4 mile times? How are you beating them?

I'm fully built with a 5857 and if I run any Honda from a dig(without my DR's or slicks) I'm getting left off the line up until about 60-70mph. I'm sure he's running guys on a street comparable to an 1/8th mile. In a full quarter stage 2's would get him.

[Got Insulin?]

**** me right? :mad:

Relax, bud. When the dude with a drag Honda and a boosted daily that has had fast Honda's for years AND fabs his own parts tells the new kids on the block that they're doing it wrong, it's time to step back and learn something.

[mcperson2k]

$10 says JDMTyler edits this thread with "WTF TST IS A BUNCH OF ASSCLOWNS", deletes his posts, and disappears for three months.

[Big_Jim]

$10 says JDMTyler edits this thread with "WTF TST IS A BUNCH OF ASSCLOWNS", deletes his posts, and disappears for three months.

how much if i make his posts say that, delete his other ones, and ban him for 3 months? hahahahaha

[Bates]

$10 says JDMTyler edits this thread with "WTF TST IS A BUNCH OF ASSCLOWNS", deletes his posts, and disappears for three months.

Well great, now you surely scared him off.

[mcperson2k]

Hey, I am just going off what I have seen in the past :P

[Bates]

Hey, I am just going off what I have seen in the past :P

Haha, you are the TST Seer. I like it.

[OutToWinPAHC]

this thread sucks huge, as huge as the OPs forehead

[Dominick]

Relax, bud. When the dude with a drag Honda and a boosted daily that has had fast Honda's for years AND fabs his own parts tells the new kids on the block that they're doing it wrong, it's time to step back and learn something.

All you have to say is, "Not really." And then supply some form of proof to your claim. I would love to know more about what one needs to go boost. So please, tell me. Don't ****in blast me by telling me to stop talking, then not tell me how I'm wrong.

/rant

[lownslow95]

this thread sucks huge, as huge as the OPs forehead

:rotfl:

[ExpresS]

I wish i was cool enough to cyber bully.

[mcperson2k]

I wish i was cool enough to cyber bully.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-g5nt9x_dcDs/TZdOsRAXJiI/AAAAAAAAAMA/LPT5QPX8V8g/s1600/wish.jpg

[OutToWinPAHC]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xj3mv_i-wish-skee-lo_music#.UKgyu4b4KWk

[Got Insulin?]

All you have to say is, "Not really." And then supply some form of proof to your claim. I would love to know more about what one needs to go boost. So please, tell me. Don't ****in blast me by telling me to stop talking, then not tell me how I'm wrong.

/rant

Why are you so hype, man? We're all playing nice here and nobody blasted you at all. If you're getting this upset over a humorous .gif and an invitation to do your own research on the topic, then you should probably take a deep breath before posting. There is no right way to build a car, but there not so intelligent ways as well as there are better ways and OGs typically know enough to offer some insight, but usually are not going to do the footwork for you as they had to do it themselves. It's a right of passage, man.

If I was being as nasty as you're acting like, I would have told you to stop being such a ninny, learn how to use the search function/ Google, and mutter something about how we don't spoon feed the new kids. Research and time should be put in before posting questions about an intended set-up, and it's apparent that both were a bit lacking in the OPs post. Not the end of the world.

[Dominick]

Why are you so hype, man? We're all playing nice here and nobody blasted you at all. If you're getting this upset over a humorous .gif and an invitation to do your own research on the topic, then you should probably take a deep breath before posting. There is no right way to build a car, but there not so intelligent ways as well as there are better ways and OGs typically know enough to offer some insight, but usually are not going to do the footwork for you as they had to do it themselves. It's a right of passage, man.

If I was being as nasty as you're acting like, I would have told you to stop being such a ninny, learn how to use the search function/ Google, and mutter something about how we don't spoon feed the new kids. Research and time should be put in before posting questions about an intended set-up, and it's apparent that both were a bit lacking in the OPs post. Not the end of the world.

i wasn't asking for a lecture on how to do the entire job. OG's can't have enough tolerance to type another 4 words and share some of their "all powerful" and "respected" knowledge" with "n00bs?"


With the EK hatchs being as light as they are, and his VTEC engaging at 4800, I can certainly see him pulling on K20s and some SRT4's.

JDMTyler, I would go the Buddy Club N/A motor route you had listed. EVERYONE turbos Honda's. It's getting to monotonus. It takes more ability to build a N/A motor and have it beat boosted cars.

I'd get some 700ish injectors and maybe a ITR throttle body to add to your list.

"Not really Dominick. EK hatches aren't as light as some say they are. And...blah blah blah (about how staged SRT4s are SOOOOOO fast). And turbo'ed builds are just as difficult as all motor builds, maybe even more. And you wouldn't need 700cc injectors at all. You'd need....(enter correct info here)."

That would have sufficed. Short, sweet and too the point. OG's don't earn respect from n00bs because the treat them like ****. And they wonder why we, n00bs ask such retarded questions.

[underpressure02]

Relax, bud. When the dude with a drag Honda and a boosted daily that has had fast Honda's for years AND fabs his own parts tells the new kids on the block that they're doing it wrong, it's time to step back and learn something.

Were you talking about yourself or me in that reply?

[PunkboySL2]

Stop. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about.

OP, I don't think you know what it takes to do either build, so I would just leave it the way it is. Your mod list is... all over the place. You've addressed all the wrong areas, under addressed some of the most crucial, and completely missed the rest.

I didn't read through the entire thread, but Aaron pretty much got it right here.

I'll say something from personal experience, when you boost something and you want it to last make sure you build with quality parts where it matters (turbo, wastegate, BOV, intercooler, etc) and absolutely make sure that it is tuned properly. People said I shouldn't have ran 11psi on a T3 on a stock saturn motor for months and months without it melting pistons, breaking ring lands etc etc. Well I did just that with a slapped together turbo kit and a good tune. I doubled factory horsepower at only 7 psi and the car has been running reliably (minus a few things not having to do with being boosted) for over a year and the same motor was in my other car which was also running 11psi on a bigger turbo, was beaten on a lot, taken to the track, ran on the dyno, and driven everywhere.

Basically if you're going to boost it do a lot of research and learn what it takes exactly to turbo your car and have it be reliable. People make it sound a lot more difficult than it actually is because well, people are generally stupid and don't know how to build cars lol. That is why they blow up their ****.

Also, 700cc injectors for an N/A B series build lolol WUT?! You sir need to stop the advice giving until you learn some more about automobiles.

[mcperson2k]

I'm confused, you told him to use quality parts and than you said you used a slapped together turbo kit. Slapped together doesn't typically mean quality?

[redtoprps13]

a pieced together kit using quality parts will typically be better than a shelf kit since it will be tailored to your needs.

[JerzyVR4]

Im not to into hondas myself so maybe all im about to say is worthless but for "most cars" my info is correct. But Boosting is NOT easy by any means. The power gains from a turbo are much greater then a 4 cyl NA. From my personal experience if you want to go NA get a v8 or bigger. Anything smaller then a v8 should be boosted by a turbo. For instance you do not hear about the amazing NA Supra's, you only hear about the Single turbo ones. As far as blowing up your motor from boosting. You need to be smart do your services on an engine and make sure its in good running condition, 60/120k services. Then you need to be able to log for Knock or Reduction in Timing, check your air/fuel ratios. you always want to have 0 knock from my experience but i have herd of some people doing fine with 44 counts of knock in an EVO believe it or not. Ebay kits i have no experience with. But i can tell you the bigger the turbo the more lag you will have. I would suggest staying away from Meth/alch inject because the pump can go bad suddenly or Seize, There goes your motor right there if you don't know about it. Hope i shed-ed some light on your situation.

[Got Insulin?]

Were you talking about yourself or me in that reply?

I was actually implying Aaron there, but forgot that you've also had a few fast Hondas, among other things.

[Eion]

Im not to into hondas myself so maybe all im about to say is worthless but for "most cars" my info is correct. But Boosting is NOT easy by any means. The power gains from a turbo are much greater then a 4 cyl NA. From my personal experience if you want to go NA get a v8 or bigger. Anything smaller then a v8 should be boosted by a turbo. For instance you do not hear about the amazing NA Supra's, you only hear about the Single turbo ones. As far as blowing up your motor from boosting. You need to be smart do your services on an engine and make sure its in good running condition, 60/120k services. Then you need to be able to log for Knock or Reduction in Timing, check your air/fuel ratios. you always want to have 0 knock from my experience but i have herd of some people doing fine with 44 counts of knock in an EVO believe it or not. Ebay kits i have no experience with. But i can tell you the bigger the turbo the more lag you will have. I would suggest staying away from Meth/alch inject because the pump can go bad suddenly or Seize, There goes your motor right there if you don't know about it. Hope i shed-ed some light on your situation.

^^ def. if you're gonna go turbo don't make the mistake of immediately putting it on your car when you don't even have all of the parts necessary to get it up and running right, just collect parts, gauges, and other random **** you need. just like what everyone else says, it's all in a proper tune and with a healthy motor.

[underpressure02]

I was actually implying Aaron there, but forgot that you've also had a few fast Hondas, among other things.

HAHA thanks :mrgreen:

Been into turbo hondas since 99. I remember when I made over 300 at the wheels in 99 and had one of the first AEM beta boxes and that was "alot" of power. Now it seems like no one cares unless you make over 1000 at the wheels.

[xEJ20x]

I like how the OP hasn't even commented/chimed in since the 6th post.

[SovXietday]

Relax, bud. When the dude with a drag Honda and a boosted daily that has had fast Honda's for years AND fabs his own parts tells the new kids on the block that they're doing it wrong, it's time to step back and learn something.

LOL, so sig worthy.

All you have to say is, "Not really." And then supply some form of proof to your claim. I would love to know more about what one needs to go boost. So please, tell me. Don't ****in blast me by telling me to stop talking, then not tell me how I'm wrong.

Not really Dominick. EK hatches aren't as light as some say they are. And...blah blah blah (about how staged SRT4s are SOOOOOO fast). And turbo'ed builds are just as difficult as all motor builds, maybe even more. And you wouldn't need 700cc injectors at all. You'd need....(enter correct info here)."

That would have sufficed. Short, sweet and too the point. OG's don't earn respect from n00bs because the treat them like ****. And they wonder why we, n00bs ask such retarded questions.

Couple of points here.

1) I told you to stop talking because you were making a complete ass of yourself. I know you are new, that's why I really didn't pick you apart like I so easily could have. I just don't like it when people are telling everyone things as if they know, when I know that you have no idea what it means when an injector is rated for 700CC/min or 50lb/hr. Infact I'd be willing to bet that you didn't even know that they were rated on any time scale at all, lol.

Anyone here who has met me or asked me a question knows that I am only too happy to answer any question they ask me if I feel as if they've researched some themselves and want clarification. I also don't claim to know all, and if I don't know I don't have a problem saying that I don't. There are plenty of people who I look to if i have questions as well, I'm not really that old myself.

2) I don't ask many questions. Most of the time, you can find the answer that you are looking for with google, or by going out and trying it yourself. Most kids don't seem to pick that idea up.

When I was 17, my dad and I put a Jackson Racing supercharger on my car. When I was 18, I took it off and went turbo. I taught myself how to tune my own car with the help of Steve Pearson. I hit 325whp on a single cam when I was 20, dad helped me build the engine and I built the rest myself, self tuned. I finally made 400whp 2 years later on E85, which at the time most people still weren't running. Last year I broke it all down and got ambitious, now I'm going for 800whp, self tuned, self fabricated. I still have a lot to learn, guys like underpressure are the type of guys I used to "look up" to when I was younger, building my first boosted car, learning from them and reading about there experiences online. Back then, those guys had to fight like hell to make 350whp on a Honda, kids now take it for granted.

3) Honestly, I think you (Dominick) have the desire to do something. The OP of this thread, he has just traded the same car for a different shade of gray thirty times, and I know he won't put in the effort to learn and will likely fail. Sorry that I came off like an asshole, and I applaud you not trying to argue with me and instead just asking for a little respect and an explanation. :thumbup:

Not to drag this post out any longer, but I'll go ahead and show you where you are wrong.

VTEC engagement being set lower is not usually a good thing. If you need to read more into it, go here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcT_ZyY3F0k

While he says 4500rpm, he is talking about a stock, normal car. The low cam makes more torque at lower engine speeds than the high cam. In order to correctly set it, you need to find the point at which the torque from the low cam crosses the torque from the high cam, and that is your engagement point. Smooth transition, and will make the most horsepower through the entire powerband. Setting it too low will cost you power, not make more.

Throttle bodies and stockish replacement intake manifolds do very little for an N/A Honda. IMs are extremely technical, and you would honestly need to be more familiar with fluid mechanics and aerodynamics for me to really discuss it further, but all in all you should have correct runner length for your build, velocity stacks at each runner, and better yet, ITBs.

Injectors are rated in either CC/min or lb/hr. Both are getting at the same thing, but are in different units. Since this is Honda, we'll stick to CC. Cubic centimeters is a volume. So a 700cc/min can discharge 700ccs of fuel in one minute at maximum. There are mathematical formulas to determine roughly how much injector you need for your power, and it depends on everything from the fuel pressure you are using, the number of injectors, the type of fuel, and even the RPM. While it is ok to shoot high and not use it all, a 200whp on gas needs around 300cc/min. Using an injector that can output over twice as much fuel is not only a waste, but it becomes inaccurate. Imagine trying to fill your bowl of cereal in the morning using the spicket on the milk truck. Will you get milk in your cereal? Yep, and on the floor, your pants, etc. Same idea with too big of an injector, a high output injector trying to make low outputs will make partial throttle messy and maybe even full throttle if its just too big. That being said, there are new injectors on the market that are much much more accurate at bigger sizes, but they are quite expensive too.

Yay for Wednesday off.

[DPancoast]

I feel like I just got raped with information.

Didn't have a reason to learn it, but didn't know it and learned it anyway.

Not sure if thankful, or time wasted :P

[redtoprps13]

LOL, so sig worthy.





Couple of points here.

1) I told you to stop talking because you were making a complete ass of yourself. I know you are new, that's why I really didn't pick you apart like I so easily could have. I just don't like it when people are telling everyone things as if they know, when I know that you have no idea what it means when an injector is rated for 700CC/min or 50lb/hr. Infact I'd be willing to bet that you didn't even know that they were rated on any time scale at all, lol.

Anyone here who has met me or asked me a question knows that I am only too happy to answer any question they ask me if I feel as if they've researched some themselves and want clarification. I also don't claim to know all, and if I don't know I don't have a problem saying that I don't. There are plenty of people who I look to if i have questions as well, I'm not really that old myself.

2) I don't ask many questions. Most of the time, you can find the answer that you are looking for with google, or by going out and trying it yourself. Most kids don't seem to pick that idea up.

When I was 17, my dad and I put a Jackson Racing supercharger on my car. When I was 18, I took it off and went turbo. I taught myself how to tune my own car with the help of Steve Pearson. I hit 325whp on a single cam when I was 20, dad helped me build the engine and I built the rest myself, self tuned. I finally made 400whp 2 years later on E85, which at the time most people still weren't running. Last year I broke it all down and got ambitious, now I'm going for 800whp, self tuned, self fabricated. I still have a lot to learn, guys like underpressure are the type of guys I used to "look up" to when I was younger, building my first boosted car, learning from them and reading about there experiences online. Back then, those guys had to fight like hell to make 350whp on a Honda, kids now take it for granted.

3) Honestly, I think you (Dominick) have the desire to do something. The OP of this thread, he has just traded the same car for a different shade of gray thirty times, and I know he won't put in the effort to learn and will likely fail. Sorry that I came off like an asshole, and I applaud you not trying to argue with me and instead just asking for a little respect and an explanation. :thumbup:

Not to drag this post out any longer, but I'll go ahead and show you where you are wrong.

VTEC engagement being set lower is not usually a good thing. If you need to read more into it, go here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AcT_ZyY3F0k

While he says 4500rpm, he is talking about a stock, normal car. The low cam makes more torque at lower engine speeds than the high cam. In order to correctly set it, you need to find the point at which the torque from the low cam crosses the torque from the high cam, and that is your engagement point. Smooth transition, and will make the most horsepower through the entire powerband. Setting it too low will cost you power, not make more.

Throttle bodies and stockish replacement intake manifolds do very little for an N/A Honda. IMs are extremely technical, and you would honestly need to be more familiar with fluid mechanics and aerodynamics for me to really discuss it further, but all in all you should have correct runner length for your build, velocity stacks at each runner, and better yet, ITBs.

Injectors are rated in either CC/min or lb/hr. Both are getting at the same thing, but are in different units. Since this is Honda, we'll stick to CC. Cubic centimeters is a volume. So a 700cc/min can discharge 700ccs of fuel in one minute at maximum. There are mathematical formulas to determine roughly how much injector you need for your power, and it depends on everything from the fuel pressure you are using, the number of injectors, the type of fuel, and even the RPM. While it is ok to shoot high and not use it all, a 200whp on gas needs around 300cc/min. Using an injector that can output over twice as much fuel is not only a waste, but it becomes inaccurate. Imagine trying to fill your bowl of cereal in the morning using the spicket on the milk truck. Will you get milk in your cereal? Yep, and on the floor, your pants, etc. Same idea with too big of an injector, a high output injector trying to make low outputs will make partial throttle messy and maybe even full throttle if its just too big. That being said, there are new injectors on the market that are much much more accurate at bigger sizes, but they are quite expensive too.

Yay for Wednesday off.

LOL Steve Pearson. I remember when he was tuning out of his little garage in Bridgeport like 6-7 years ago. He street tuned my t25g 240sx 7 years ago. Thing would break the tires loose in 3rd gear.. but yes do not recommend things you do not understand. You will cost somebody their car or their life.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

[PunkboySL2]

I'm confused, you told him to use quality parts and than you said you used a slapped together turbo kit. Slapped together doesn't typically mean quality?

Sorry, I should've clarified better. My manifold/downipe and some of the intercooler piping is kind of shotty, but it all holds together and it working fine, but the kit I put together used a garrett turbo, tial WG and BOV as well as a precision intercooler and all tuned on Megasquirt instead of using ebay parts and something like a piggy back controller with bigger injectors. If I would have someone finish up the intercooler piping and just go to a nice solid log manifold and a better stainless downpipe setup it would be nicer, but it all works even though it doesn't look the best. I didn't fabricate anything, but I put it all together myself on the cheap. Only thing my friends did was build the downpipe and wastegate dump. Just saying if you're going to build a turbo car, make sure you put money where it matters most if you're on a budget. Easy enough to do on a honda since I'm sure you could pick up everything used.